Thoughts after the most important game of pre-season.

[Neo]

Originally Posted by YtownBacker

First team offense looked good. They don't need the wildcat to manufacturer points but it will be an added bonus when they turn it loose. QB play is solid. WR have progressed by leaps and bounds from last year. Running game is still solid and Vickers is an animal.

Actually through 3 Qtrs the 1st team defense gave up 14 points. The offense gave up 7 points. I can't understand all the playing time for Barton. TEs and back just run away from him. Elam couldn't cover me and I'm 61. Bowens looked real slow and out of step the whole game. The positive aspect of tonight is that most of the guys out there playing in the front 7 on defense in the 4th qtr won't be on the team in two weeks.

As far as or 3rd team QB playing with a bunch of scrubs...................I really don't give a shit. BTW, he put the pass exactly where it was suppose to be for Mitchell to make the catch for the first down. Another drop by Mitchell ended the drive.

Ventrone is solid on special teams but sucks as a safety. Bowens looks slow and out of shape. Maybe a step slower then Barton. Elam sucks and I hope they reconsider and put Brown at FS. Brown is a savy veteran but seems to have lost a step.

Haden and Ward play above their experience level. These two guys can play ball.

Man our OL better stay healthy because are backups suck.

Engram got a chance tonight to earn the #5 receiver job. He just may make the team because there isn't anything behind MoMass, Robo, Cribbs and Stuckey.

First game of the season we are going to see if this offense is for real when Tampa tries to take away the TEs and back out of the backfield. Hillis out of the backfield was just way to easy. Sooner or later someone is going to make Jake throw the ball down the field.

Preseason is just that so you take it for what it's worth. Teams don't like to show their hands or let opponents see much.

I cannot say it enough how much Denver got torched on that trade for Hillis.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by TheBestPlayersPlay
-Delhomme is what we thought he is (at least a few of us)...a damned good QB who had 1 god awful year. Clearly the best QB in a Browns Uni since Kosar. A lot of you seem to be pulling for Wallace to start and/or get a ton of action, I'm hoping the opposite. The less we see of Wallace the better, he's a good back-up but he's no Jake Delhomme. Prediction : Barring major injuries, Delhomme makes a push for the pro-bowl this season.

-Even in the very first training camp session, I commented how much better Cribbs was looking at WR. People kept claiming the opposite as TC and pre-season games played out ...but I am hoping he's changing your minds.

-Harrison has done little to nothing to impress me. He's not good enough as a feature back to be putting the ball on the ground as much as he has been. Prediction: When all is said and done, Harrison will be our 3rd down back ...if that. He's not, or at least shouldn't be a feature back.

-Hillis is a beast. He's the guy I'd like to see in combination with Hardesty this season. (if Hardesty is as good as advertised)

-Ben Watson is better than I hoped.

-Daboll is who we thought he is. (a couple of us) A smart, young O-coordinator who was growing leaps and bound towards the end of last season, and is continuing to grow into what looks to be a creative, intelligent coach.

-I hope Haden takes the starting CB spot so that Brown takes Elams spot.

-Elam sucks.

-Sheldon Brown is not as good as advertised.

-Not too worried about our D ...they look disciplined for the most part, and we are currently missing key components. Pre-season D is usually more vanilla than even the O, we're not showing much.

I'll stick with my pre pre-season prediction of 7-9. That being said, I am even more positive about our team. I could easily see a few breaks going our way, and us getting 10 wins and a play-off berth. (again, barring injuries ..we aren't deep enough yet) Yes, I said it.

(I know the game is not over yet, so I may have more to add)

Nice post Gabe! I'm VERY happy to see how Delhomme is playing and LEADING the offense. I NEVER agreed he was a bad QB when healthy. That said, I'd be lying if I didn't fess up to worrying about him and thinking Wallace might be the better answer at this stage of both of their careers. There's gonna be defenses like Baltimore and Pittsburgh that will knock Jake down and he may land on the elbow. It hasn't had ANY trauma all offseason or in training camp practices where they aren't allowed to hit the QB.

About today - Jake was very efficient just like he was vrs GB. For that matter, just like he was the final 3 quarters of the Superbowl. He's got some underrated leadership qualities that get a synergistic boost when he gets hot.

I haven't been nearly as impressed with Jerome Harrison this preseason as I was with him at the close of 2009. Much to my surprise, the guy I want to see getting the ball is Hillis behind the blocking of Vickers. Speaking of Vickers - HOW ABOUT that TD reception? Now that we have a QB capable of putting a pass in front of him and above the grass - it reminded me he CAME to Cleveland with 2 pretty nice hands to go with his blocking skills.

I was VERY disappointed I didn't get to see Montario Hardesty. That said, James Davis provided some of the same excitement he gave us last year at this time. Man, he side stepped someone and took off like someone had a lighter to his fanny.

The oline did a nice job tonight against a much improved 4 man front. Our WRs and TEs continued to show me they can make plays. Josh Cribbs had the play of the day on the sidelines getting both feet in bounds and catching the ball. Just more evidence suggesting he CAN improve significantly at WR. Carlton Mitchell had a better outting with a nice reverse. I think he also crushed a DE with a wham block and he made a ctach or 2. MoMass and Robo were reliable when called upon.

Defensively - I'll go with the good, the bad and the ugly:

The good was Joe Haden was always where he was supposed to be and he made ALOT of nice open field tackles.

The bad - Sheldon Brown keeps getting burnt everygame (moreso than the younger guys like Haden and Wright IMO). I'd try to get him into Elam's spot as soon as possible; because he would probably be much better in space. Elam hasn't impressed anyone so we could conceivably upgrade 2 different positions in teh secondary with this move.

The ugly - it's being mentioned by others that we aren't contesting the pass at all. Our LBers have also been terrible in their zones for the most part while we're not getting consistent pressure on the QB. The saddest part of my ugly here is that David Bowens looks like he lost about 3-4 steps from late last season. Not that he's ever been a speedster per say; but he's not even CLOSE to the guy I saw late last year. Reality is this will be his 11th season so father time might have snuk up on him or I'm jumping the gun off of tonight.

I'm HOPING alot of what we've seen is vanilla defense so our staff can EVALUATE our DBs under worst case scenarios. We've also been sending very LAZY delayed inside blitz/stunts, which leaves us 1 ILB splitting 2 hook zones. Haven't seen many/any ILBers getting sacks. I think I've only seen Titus Brown and Chris Gocong bat a pass down in the hook zones in 3 games so far.

I WISH we'd FREAKIN find out how long Shaun Rogers will be out. Just putting him next to Matt Roth or Marcus Benard could REALLY change things considerably in our front 7 IMO. I don't think we ever got to see Rogers have the pleasure of playing alongside either spark in 2009. I'm very intrigued to see the sum of those parts working together.

The best news about tonight is that no starters got injured AND I heard Sorensen was able to move and joke with family at the hospital.
- Tom F.

[Sez.EJ]

Right tackle is still a huge concern, starters and backups blowing bye and getting at the qb.Pass protection overall was not great tonight. Good thing Jake can get the ball out of his hand fast or he'd already be dead on the turf... Our RB's were living on the right side to help out the RT without much success. Harrison looks mediocre, Hillis has won the starting tailback job IMO although he probably won't start.. I'm anxious to see Hardesty and hoping against hope he can win the starting tailback job by week 3.. Vickers is the man.

Jake looks great.. WHY ON EARTH DO YOU TAKE HIM OUT ON 1ST DOWN ON THE 10 1/2 YARD LINE FOR WALLACE IN THE FIRST QUARTER?.. I understand we want to try some things..but let Jake get some goal line reps..what a waste of an opportunity.

Wallace was just average. He's a backup and anyone thinking he should take reps from Jake needs smacked in the head.

As for our young boy Colt.. McCoy thew a couple EXCELLENT sideline passes especially the one he threw to the receivers back shoulder.. pro QB throw all the way... He has a long....long..long way to go, but looked more comfortable than last week. Pass protection was pathetic.On the fumble he was still in his drop back when he got hit.. Umm right tackle please?? . He was inaccurate on a few throws. either behind or in front of the receivers... However, he looked better than weeks 1 and 2.. He's about where he should be getting so few reps.. I am curious to see him get some extended time next week.


Defense..same old story. hmm did I just say same old story?? . DL gets blocked back into the linebackers... play after play,... and the linebackers are bum rushed by the OL.. UMMM no pass rush.. ZERO pass rush.... WOW.. did I just cut and paste this from every post on the defense from the past 5 years ???

Secondary.. It's so hard to tell when you have no pass rush.. no secondary in the league can cover good recievers for 6 seconds. So actaully they were not that bad. They might even be good, but we'll never know until the qb actually has to throw the ball with a sense of urgency.

Special teams were just average.


Detroits big 3..stafford, Johnson, Best.. are going to take that team to the next level.. amazing what happens when Matt Millen gets kicked to the curb..

[Sez.EJ]

Oh..just another thought on Mccoy 10-14 for 76 isn't bad.. 7.5 yards per catch..nearly identical to Delhommes at 7.6 yardsper catch.. The just look very different doing it..that's a 37 yr old vet vs a 21 yr old rookie.. Let's hope he can look like jake in a couple years.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Sez.EJ

Oh..just another thought on Mccoy 10-14 for 76 isn't bad.. 7.5 yards per catch..nearly identical to Delhommes at 7.6 yardsper catch.. The just look very different doing it..that's a 37 yr old vet vs a 21 yr old rookie.. Let's hope he can look like jake in a couple years.

Like you said in your previous reply - that sideline throw was REALLY good. Let's not forget this 3rd string oline has been overwhelmed every week thus far and 1-2 of his targets will get cut while another seems destined to the practice squad. It'll be interesting to see if they keep Taurus Johnson or Bobby Engram. UNLESS they decide to keep Mitchell and place Johnson on the practice squad.

I'm sure the critics are gonna harp on too many check downs as they want us thinking McCoy had far too many superstars running uncontested routes all over the field. I'm puzzled people want to make their 2010 thesis all about Mccoy failing here. It's almost like there's some sort of viagra feeding this.

Outside of McCoy's rookie blunder on the 2nd to last play of the game (chewing 15 seconds for a meaningless 5 yard gain) you've showed us he ended up 10 of 14 throwign the ball. If ANY other rookie turns in this stat - they're praised for it.

It's WAY too early for conclusions. Did anyone hear what Aaron Rodger said he accomplsihed most during his 3 years of watching Favre? He said was able to add the strength to his arm that he felt the NFL demanded of him. Hmmm, sounds like that took about the same amount of time Drew Brees necessitated. And what did San Diego assume far too soon? They needed a REAL QB with their first overall pick when they didn't understand Brees was about to turn in a Pro Bowl season. Brees pretty much said the same thing when he was asked about his improvement in season 3. He said his personal trainer got him in the best shape of his life and he's never been stronger. Hmmmm. It's not an unrealistic evolution.

Did anyone ever hear Tom Brady talk about what happened between his rookie year and his second year? How he went from blue jeans on game day to superstar? He said he had a sitdown with BB heading into his very first offseason. BB told him straight up what he needed to improve. He needed to be more physically fit which included becoming stronger.

Common theme here? Getting stronger isn't impossible for guys that are highly driven to succeed especially when there's access to some strength and conditioning professionals with PhD's in Ex Phys.

Can we exhale and relax a little bit about McCoy's process folks? 10 of 14 passing isn't horrible.
- Tom F.

[Jax Dawg]

First off, I tried watching this game live with my two little girls screaming in one ear and wife trying to talk to me in the other so I was in/out of the game for stretches.

I thought the game plan with Delhomme was perfect to start the game. A lot of quick 3 step drops and fire the ball to the open man to neutralize the good DL and bad DB's of Detroit. The Det DL got so frustrated when they finally got to Jake (late) they got called for 2 roughing the passers and Suh is going to get a hefty fine for his grabbing Jake by the facemask (after a completion BTW) then trying to take his head off as he manhandled him to the ground.

Didn't understand putting Wallace in there on 1st and goal on the 1st series when Delhomme was on fire unless we went with a heavy dose of wildcat with Cribbs which wasn't the case. Then they put Delhomme back in there on 3rd and goal after 2 incompletions by Wallace and just out thunk ourselves into a FG instead of a TD.

Starting OL looked very good except Pashos looked a little ST Clair-esque on pass protection. Hopefully that improves with more reps. B/U OL looked terrible again, how can anyone fairly judge our B/U QB or RB's with that line is beyond me.

I'm a little concerned about our D right now but then I know this isn't the same D we will see in the regular season. I look around the NFL scoreboard and realize every team is playing very vanilla D around the NFL right now. Most starting QB's are tearing up everybody. Hell, GB put up 59 on the Colts! The Lambs beat NE in a shootout! Does anybody honestly think the this is how the games will look once they start to count?

These fumbles are getting out of control! Harrison will lose reps because of his inability to hold on to the football. What's up with Moore carrying the ball like a loaf of bread in the open field? And do we still have Center-QB exchange problems after all the reps of OTA's and training camp? Really? Other than this, the 1st team O looks at least 100x's better than last year! I'm excited to see a real offense and Browns being mentioned in the same breath.

Hated the fact I had to listen to the Detroit commentators while watching the game on NFL network. It is a lot easier to notice players doing good/bad when you have Browns commentators talking about the game and players. I still haven't figured out who all the new guys are by their numbers yet which will only come with time.

Mitchell looked good on an early reverse for about a 20 yard gain then displayed his stone hands again when passes were thrown his way. Keep it up and he may be headed for the practice squad where anybody can take him from us.

[Enigmatic Evil]

Originally Posted by WVBrownsfan

IMO with Jake and Seneca in camp, Colt isn't getting the reps or the attention that Bradford is because he's the Rams starter right now. I know he hasn't shown much yet but I still have to give him more time before calling him a bust. I'm just happy as a clam that we have not only one but two QB's that can throw the ball on target for a change and Colt can watch and learn from them. Plus with Wallace's scrambling ability at QB that can let Josh concentrate strictly on being a receiver or coming out of the backfield. I'm ready for the season to start !

This is what I've been trying to say. Colt hasn't be getting the kind of reps to build any chemistry with his teammates. The kind of Chemistry that Jake Delhomme has been building and it shows with Jake. Colt is getting a TON of flak and I honestly am not surprised by this but I think that it's bordering on absurdity. Give Colt a break guys, let's worry about Jake and Seneca this season.

[Legacy Fan]

Originally Posted by Alo

Having you starting QB complete 80% of his passes, on the other hand, is a pretty huge positive.

Greatest part of the night, imo.

[Thaak]

Originally Posted by Sez.EJ

Oh..just another thought on Mccoy 10-14 for 76 isn't bad.. 7.5 yards per catch..nearly identical to Delhommes at 7.6 yardsper catch.. The just look very different doing it..that's a 37 yr old vet vs a 21 yr old rookie.. Let's hope he can look like jake in a couple years.

There was a moment when Colt was 8 for 8 to start his night.

[YtownBacker]

Originally Posted by Jax Dawg

First off, I tried watching this game live with my two little girls screaming in one ear and wife trying to talk to me in the other so I was in/out of the game for stretches.

I thought the game plan with Delhomme was perfect to start the game. A lot of quick 3 step drops and fire the ball to the open man to neutralize the good DL and bad DB's of Detroit. The Det DL got so frustrated when they finally got to Jake (late) they got called for 2 roughing the passers and Suh is going to get a hefty fine for his grabbing Jake by the facemask (after a completion BTW) then trying to take his head off as he manhandled him to the ground.

Didn't understand putting Wallace in there on 1st and goal on the 1st series when Delhomme was on fire unless we went with a heavy dose of wildcat with Cribbs which wasn't the case. Then they put Delhomme back in there on 3rd and goal after 2 incompletions by Wallace and just out thunk ourselves into a FG instead of a TD.

Starting OL looked very good except Pashos looked a little ST Clair-esque on pass protection. Hopefully that improves with more reps. B/U OL looked terrible again, how can anyone fairly judge our B/U QB or RB's with that line is beyond me.

I'm a little concerned about our D right now but then I know this isn't the same D we will see in the regular season. I look around the NFL scoreboard and realize every team is playing very vanilla D around the NFL right now. Most starting QB's are tearing up everybody. Hell, GB put up 59 on the Colts! The Lambs beat NE in a shootout! Does anybody honestly think the this is how the games will look once they start to count?

These fumbles are getting out of control! Harrison will lose reps because of his inability to hold on to the football. What's up with Moore carrying the ball like a loaf of bread in the open field? And do we still have Center-QB exchange problems after all the reps of OTA's and training camp? Really? Other than this, the 1st team O looks at least 100x's better than last year! I'm excited to see a real offense and Browns being mentioned in the same breath.

Hated the fact I had to listen to the Detroit commentators while watching the game on NFL network. It is a lot easier to notice players doing good/bad when you have Browns commentators talking about the game and players. I still haven't figured out who all the new guys are by their numbers yet which will only come with time.

Mitchell looked good on an early reverse for about a 20 yard gain then displayed his stone hands again when passes were thrown his way. Keep it up and he may be headed for the practice squad where anybody can take him from us.

I agree, if Gocaong got fined last week then Suh should get hit hard for his facemask pull down.

I don't really thin Mack and Delhimme have the exchange problems it's the guards pulling and Jake not geting out of the way fast enough. Seems to be a lot of stepping on toes or bumping into the QB.

I think the insertion of Wallace was just something to get other teams to have to work on and think about when game planning for the Browns. Don't forget they are also wondering what we are going to be doing with the wildcat. I think inserting Wallace was a great ploy.

[Masters]

Originally Posted by YtownBacker

I think the insertion of Wallace was just something to get other teams to have to work on and think about when game planning for the Browns. Don't forget they are also wondering what we are going to be doing with the wildcat. I think inserting Wallace was a great ploy.

I have to disagree with you on it being a great ploy. If I was now game planning againt the Browns, I'd be happy to allow them to go to that Wallace/pistol formation after driving into the redzone. All it did was mess up the offensive rythem and waste a redzone TD opportunity. If CLE wants to settle for 3 instead of 7, the only wondering from the other side would be why would you waste a redzone opportunity.

[Dan in Florida]

I just finished watching/replaying (much in slo-mo) the OFFENSE in the 1st half & I rewatched Colt at the end of the game.

I was REALLY impressed with Jake. I thought the game plan to neutralize the Lions D-Line was great.

Well, we have a young "starting" Right Guard now...I paid extra attention to OG Lauvau with his matchup with SUH. I thought he did a great job, he seemed to be in sync with Mack (helping each other). The one play where SUH came through and face masked (and tried to rip Jake's head off), Lauvau was blocking SUH, one on one, when a Lion came flying in the hole to the right of Lauvau (and to the left of Pashos (who was blocking wide), and Lauvau switched to the man who would have gotten to Jake alot sooner... unfortunately that freed up SUH who DOUBLE cheap-shotted Jake. BTW - I think SUH should be SUSPENDED & FINED! Jake "CLEARLY" had gotten rid of the ball, and he could have broken Jake's neck there...a message needs to be sent on that from the Commish!

Pachos didn't look that bad to me either after watching in slo-mo.

Hillis is amazing and becoming my favorite guy to watch. Gotta credit Vickers blocking too!

After re-watching Colt, he was efficient in his ultra short passing game with his scrubs. I'm still not sold on him but he has plenty of time to be groomed I guess.