Browns Best New Players on Defense...

[Shep]

I think our defense has a lot to look forward to already, getting Shaun Rogers and D'Qwell Jackson back to play for the first time with new starters Ahtyba Rubin and Matt Roth.

If Pool really is healthy, as his doctor says, we have the core of a really good defense. I think we'll still bring in some new talent at CB and S, but I don't see holes there as big as we have at WR, for instance.

If we could start Rubin, Rogers, and Smith/Mosley/Shaefering on the line and Roth, Bowens, Jackson, Wimbley at LB (Maiava in the nickel), I think we're fielding a very nice front 7.

A defensive backfield of Wright, McCourty, Pool, and Elam, with McDonald and Adams around for the nickel? Also sounds very good.

I think we're a LOT closer on D than on O. That's why I'd like to see a blue-chipper added there, like Dez Bryant... or Sam Bradford.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Shep

I think our defense has a lot to look forward to already, getting Shaun Rogers and D'Qwell Jackson back to play for the first time with new starters Ahtyba Rubin and Matt Roth.

If Pool really is healthy, as his doctor says, we have the core of a really good defense. I think we'll still bring in some new talent at CB and S, but I don't see holes there as big as we have at WR, for instance.

If we could start Rubin, Rogers, and Smith/Mosley/Shaefering on the line and Roth, Bowens, Jackson, Wimbley at LB (Maiava in the nickel), I think we're fielding a very nice front 7.

A defensive backfield of Wright, McCourty, Pool, and Elam, with McDonald and Adams around for the nickel? Also sounds very good.

I think we're a LOT closer on D than on O. That's why I'd like to see a blue-chipper added there, like Dez Bryant... or Sam Bradford.

Nice post Shep!

Bowens knocked my socks off when he moved to the inside. Roth was a GREAT addition as was Trusnik. And Marcus Benard was an undrafted rookie free agent that drew a standing ovation from ALL of his teammates the day it was announced he was promoted to the active roster. 1 week later he was like Freddie's Kruegers to Worthlessberger. I remembered having a beer or 2 too many asking - who is this little darling?

We're at the point where LBer is deep: Wimbley, Hall, Trusnik, Bowens, Barton, Jackson, Maiava, Roth, Benard, Veikune, and Costanzo. Alot of these guys can play inside or outside in a crunch as we witnessed. I almost hope we keep Bowens inside because that was a REAL spark I've longed for.

Rogers can play on the edge now that Rubin has improved. We lined him up there earlier in the year on occasion in 1 of our matchups with Robaire playing on the Nose when we did so and it worked really well. Imagine lining Wimbley up on the same side? Alot of our guys improved too like Wimbley, Williams, and Rubin to name a few.

I think we're gonna need to address the secondary though. I'd LOVE to see McDonald in the roile we once had Anthony henry in as a guy covering the slot in nickle/dime packages. Adams can fill Pool's shoes when he gets dinged up again. Hope he doesn't but whenever we get these injury trend guys the injuries never seem to disappear.

I always used to think drafting a corner in round 1 wasn't necessary. THIS year, I would really like Joe Haden if defense is the choice - Spiller if it's offense. Speed lights up a scoreboard as fast as someone gets tired, lazy or sloppy. Try to think of the defenses that score alot Shep. They have a nice pass rush but they also have REALLY good playmakers in the secondary. The Superbowl epitomized that. We witnessed a 14 point swing when a corner took a pass Manning couldn't step into for a TD the other way. Game over! I want to score on Pittsburgh's offense the way their defense has scored on us over the years. They got some payback coming that's long overdue. Same with the Ratbirds!

We also need some depth on the dline so we're not done with defense by any means. Isn't it nice when your front office doesn't deplete your draft to just 4 or 5 selections?
- Tom F.

[Sez.EJ]

There are some up and comers from the young guys.. but we were still HORRIBLE vs the run.. somebody has to go.. I think we need DE's IMO.. some guys who can get some push without us having to blitz.. we are very journeyman heavy and lack big play guys.. ROTH.. could be the steal of last season and the future. I really hope we don't let this guy get away. I think he can make an enourmous difference to Wimbley and this entire defense. He was the best player on the field the last 6 weeks.

[Shep]

We got LOTS of pressure once Roth was added. I think he had 5 sacks in 6 games or something? He really helped a ton. The pieces seemed to be coming together late in the year, and adding Rogers and Jackson alone will raise it to another level.

Tom (and all), I keep reading that Haden is one of the few elite prospects this year, even though he's a corner (not a position commonly picked in the top 10), so he certainly makes sense. I'm totally onboard with better coverage being the key to pressure on the QB, and allowing us to send people more often.

I'm just not convinced we couldn't upgrade by drafting a guy at #38 to go across from Wright, and push McDonald to the nickel.

If we DO draft Haden, I think we need to look at WRs at #38, along with a veteran like Holt. We REALLY have to improve there. I don't think all the guys we had last year will make the squad. I don't think Robiskie is a lock.

Sez: We're gonna have an amazing new DE... named Shaun Rogers.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Shep

We got LOTS of pressure once Roth was added. I think he had 5 sacks in 6 games or something? .

I don't know if alot of people remember the start Wimbley was off to before he got the swine flu that took him down for almost 2 weeks. Anyway, he had something like 4 sacks in a 5 game period, which was projecting 12 sacks in 15 games. The flu broke his momentum but we saw the guy that impressed us as a rookie return back to form. I had a hard time believing the theory he simply woke up a terrible football player 1 morning.

It really looked like players were being coached up because we saw alot of guys improving. I mean Corey Williams looked like he had the 3-4 explained to him in English. Okay, well Bryan Cox's version of English. Whatever works - there was some giddyup in Corey Williams this year. Same with Wimbley. Same with Rubin. Cox did a nice job with all the guys putting a hand down. That December trend replenished my excitement about this team moving forward. The players are buying in while the Diva's are gone.
- Tom F.

[Sez.EJ]

Originally Posted by Shep

Sez: We're gonna have an amazing new DE... named Shaun Rogers.

Funny.. I was just thinking this.. Ruben and Rogers.. better run D.... Better push without blitzing.

[damajuki]

Another Flugs sighting! Nice!

Good discussion in here.

I have to agree with Flugs that Haden makes a ton of sense for us and directly addresses a huge need.

I am intrigued with the Spiller idea, too. I know lots of people say "too high" but only production matters, in the end. If H3 think Spiller would help put up points, he's the right pick.

And I would certainly rather take an RB over a WR, especially in our case. Yes, shep, I understand our deficiencies at QB but a rookie WR faces enough challenges to producing his first year without having to deal with a QB drama. A rookie RB, on the other hand, can make a deficient QB situation better by helping loosen up D's.

Not to mention our investment in WRs last year. Not sure we can really afford to go 3 for 5 in the WR department in rounds 1 and 2 for two straight years.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by damajuki

Another Flugs sighting! Nice!

Good discussion in here.

I have to agree with Flugs that Haden makes a ton of sense for us and directly addresses a huge need.

I am intrigued with the Spiller idea, too. I know lots of people say "too high" but only production matters, in the end. If H3 think Spiller would help put up points, he's the right pick.

And I would certainly rather take an RB over a WR, especially in our case. Yes, shep, I understand our deficiencies at QB but a rookie WR faces enough challenges to producing his first year without having to deal with a QB drama. A rookie RB, on the other hand, can make a deficient QB situation better by helping loosen up D's.

Not to mention our investment in WRs last year. Not sure we can really afford to go 3 for 5 in the WR department in rounds 1 and 2 for two straight years.

Thanks Damajuki! Good point about the RB. See Shonn Greene rushing for a country mile vrs his first 2 playoff opponents. It eventually opened up play action and busted DBs for cheating up to stop him. End result? Uncontested targets downfield. TDs to a wide open Dustin Keller and BE as beneficiaries. Passes don't get any safer than uncontested for a young QB or a game manager.
- Tom F.

[PlaygroundLegend]

Originally Posted by damajuki

Another Flugs sighting! Nice!

Good discussion in here.

I have to agree with Flugs that Haden makes a ton of sense for us and directly addresses a huge need.

I am intrigued with the Spiller idea, too. I know lots of people say "too high" but only production matters, in the end. If H3 think Spiller would help put up points, he's the right pick.

And I would certainly rather take an RB over a WR, especially in our case. Yes, shep, I understand our deficiencies at QB but a rookie WR faces enough challenges to producing his first year without having to deal with a QB drama. A rookie RB, on the other hand, can make a deficient QB situation better by helping loosen up D's.

Not to mention our investment in WRs last year. Not sure we can really afford to go 3 for 5 in the WR department in rounds 1 and 2 for two straight years.

So I take it you dont believe in Harrison? He's one of the best backs in the league and we have him and you want to draft spiller? C'mon dude.

Yes, I did just say he's one of the best backs in the league, we knew this all the way back in 2007 and 2008 when Jerome was rushing for 10ypc yet rarely saw the field. We bitched and moaned for years and now finally when he's 27 we give him a shot and he jacks all the haters in the mouth with his play.

[Shep]

I'm with Playground on this: Harrison runs for 600 yards in the last five games... and we reach for C.J. Spiller at #7? The only thing that makes less sense to me is drafting a left tackle.

Our offense needs help, especially our pass offense. The truth is, Hadnot/Womack played pretty damn well those last four games, so right tackle isn't the screaming need it was. My gut says we'll draft a right-side blocker with our second pick in round 3.

Now, let's assume Quinn is staying... what does that leave, personnel-wise, to improve?

The pass catchers.

[Sony Reed]

Originally Posted by Shep

I think our defense has a lot to look forward to already, getting Shaun Rogers and D'Qwell Jackson back to play for the first time with new starters Ahtyba Rubin and Matt Roth.

If Pool really is healthy, as his doctor says, we have the core of a really good defense. I think we'll still bring in some new talent at CB and S, but I don't see holes there as big as we have at WR, for instance.

If we could start Rubin, Rogers, and Smith/Mosley/Shaefering on the line and Roth, Bowens, Jackson, Wimbley at LB (Maiava in the nickel), I think we're fielding a very nice front 7.

A defensive backfield of Wright, McCourty, Pool, and Elam, with McDonald and Adams around for the nickel? Also sounds very good.

I think we're a LOT closer on D than on O. That's why I'd like to see a blue-chipper added there, like Dez Bryant... or Sam Bradford.

Shep, while its nice to be positive, I believe this defense is alot further than you and many others believe is close to being good.

Here are just a few point.

Matt Roth is the best linebacker on this team and this is a guy we picked up on waivers

many people are talking about Kamerion Wimbley had this fantastic season, well what I saw and the stats show don't seem to say so.

Wimbley took 1021 snaps on defense, he had 7-sacks, 24 QB Pressures, 8-QB hits, Wimbley was one of only 4 outside linebackers who play in a 3-4 defense to have play in over 1000 snaps with James Harrison, LaMarr Woodley, and Tamba Hali now lets compare numbers

Woodley 14- sacks, 31 QB Presures, 15 QB Hits

Hali 9- Sacks 36 QB Pressures, 13 QB Hits

IMO Wimbley just does not make enough plays to be considered anything more than average at outside linebacker and thats they key position in a 3-4 defense.

Our defensive backfield is HORRIBLE- Abe Elam showed me nothing at safety and is terrible in the passing game, Brandon McDonald is not a starting NFL cornerback, Brodney Pool lacks instincts and ball skills and Eric Wright is getting better but his not a top corner as of yet he is too inconsistant.

This defense still needs a dominant safety, a starting cornerbacks, and a guy at inside linebacker that makes plays at the LOS, and a pass rushing outside LB to complement Matt Roth.

[Sony Reed]

Originally Posted by PlaygroundLegend

So I take it you dont believe in Harrison? He's one of the best backs in the league and we have him and you want to draft spiller? C'mon dude.

Yes, I did just say he's one of the best backs in the league, we knew this all the way back in 2007 and 2008 when Jerome was rushing for 10ypc yet rarely saw the field. We bitched and moaned for years and now finally when he's 27 we give him a shot and he jacks all the haters in the mouth with his play.

I would not be so fast in proclaiming Harrison the next great back, have we all forgot the defenses he did this against, I mean Kansas City, the Raiders and Jags were not teams that were very tough against the run this past season.

With that being said I would not draft Spiller IMO he won;t run between the tackles in the NFL, he will have to be used like the Saints use Reggie Bush