Post Game Thread

[Enigmatic Evil]

Neo sorry I can't answer the question because that no-huddle portion came after I stopped watching the game. I was watching it at a friends house and I had to walk home to make time for dinner at the In-Laws so... I missed that.

The short answer, to me, is that with this new offense being implemented, maybe we are just trying to get the players on offense used to the new system before we start going gung-ho with the no-huddle as that requires a level of familiarity... I think if it worked (obviously it did) we may be more inclined to test it out in the future.

[damajuki]

Two main thoughts from me:

1. The difference between the Browns being 1-2 and me ready to jump ship and 2-1 and me thinking playoffs now was Colt's play on one drive. One drive. That margin for error is way too narrow for a young team. The O has to get better and that starts with Shurmur and ends with Colt. Play calling has been pretty bad and Colt's accuracy today was painful so both need to keep working.

2. The defense has been an INCREDIBLE surprise. I honestly didn't think we'd be as good as last year, let alone this much better. Looks like Heckert's youth movement on D is working and this might end up being the biggest criticism of Mangini: he went too old on D for a rebuilding team. These guys look young and athletic and going double DB then double DL is paying serious dividends right now.

Bottom line: We beat a decently talented Miami team without our main offensive weapon and that counts for a LOT, both to our macro rebuild but also for the fanbase and team to buy in. I'm telling you, I was ready to go all-in with the Bills after we lost today (I'm still buying a ticket for that bandwagon) so this thing called "hope" is a pleasant feeling right now and I'm going to enjoy it for a while.

[OconRecon]

Colt rose to the occasion. That's something you can't teach. A QB who gets it done on an off day is not to be discredited, IMHO.

Terry Pluto points out: "Something to consider: The Browns have five touchdown passes. They had only 13 in 2010, 11 in 2009 and 11 in 2008. They are finding more ways to get the ball into the end zone."

This is still an offense with a pile of young players, darn near no training camp, a new coach, and a new scheme. Frankly, we shouldnt win at all.

I just finished watching the game on DVR knowing it was an ugly win. Come to find out, not that ugly!

D was awesome, Hardesty looked damn good, more Little / less Robo (a good thing), Cribbs & MoMass catching TD passes in go-get-the-ball style, and Colt pulled together a clutch drive.

Hey, we were hoping to be 2-1 at this point (although we thought the loss would be to Indy).

Go Browns!

[BernietheKid]

Terry Pluto's postgame scribbles from Cleveland Browns-Miami Dolphins

Published: Sunday, September 25, 2011, 10:02 PM Updated: Sunday, September 25, 2011, 10:02 PM
By Terry Pluto, The Plain Dealer

CLEVELAND, Ohio -- Some postgame scribbles after the cheers finally subsided.

1. The answer is ... yes. Yes, Montario Hardesty looks like a second-round draft pick. Yes, he appears healthy. Yes, he gives the Browns some depth at running back. Yes, without Hardesty, the Browns don't beat Miami, 17-16.

2. When Peyton Hillis came down with a strep throat, the Browns knew they needed Hardesty. He delivered with 67 yards in 14 carries, a 4.8 average. He deserved praise for his blocking when the Dolphins blitzed. He caught three passes. He didn't appear nervous in his first NFL start. The only negative had to do with the playcalling -- the Browns should have handed the ball more often to Hardesty, given the struggles of the passing attack until the game-winning drive.

3. Most fans know Hardesty's story. He was the second-round pick in 2010, the Browns trading a third and fifth rounder to select him. He had injury problems in college, and then hurt his knee in the final preseason game of 2010. The Browns have kept the training wheels on -- he had only eight carries (for 19 yards) in the first two games of this season.

4. But once upon a time -- 2009, to be exact -- Hardesty was a monster of a running back at Tennessee. He carried the ball 282 times for 1,345 yards and 13 touchdowns in the SEC, as close to the NFL as you'll find in college. That season inspired General Manager Tom Heckert to aggressively pursue the 6-foot, 225-pound power running back.

5. Hardesty was impressive. He'd make a quick fake, then run hard in a straight line, legs pumping, picking up those demanding yards in the middle of the line. This should show Pat Shurmur that he has two viable running backs in Hardesty and Hillis. Shurmur has to know that he can't run Hillis to exhaustion, as was the case last season. Hardesty shows there's no reason to do so.

6. When Joshua Cribbs (groin injury) didn't play on the return teams, the Browns received little in return. Jordan Norwood returned one punt for six years, Buster Skrine one kickoff for 23. Cribbs is averaging 13.8 yards a punt return, 34 yards on kickoff returns.

7. Phil Taylor had another solid game with seven tackles, a sack and two quarterback hits, combining with Ahtbya Rubin to jam up the middle of the line. The Dolphins gained 138 yards on the ground, but ran 38 times for a mediocre 3.6 average. It's early, but the Browns' run defense is better as they have allowed only one rushing touchdown (the 39-yard Cedric Benson run in the opener).

8. Jayme Mitchell looks like a steal. Obtained for a sixth-round pick last season, he didn't fit Eric Mangini's 3-4 defense but is ideal for the 4-3. Mitchell had 1.5 sacks and two other quarterback hits. The Browns have 11 sacks -- Rubin and D'Qwell Jackson lead with 2.5 each. Jackson has had at least 10 tackles in every game.

9. Give credit to Dick Jauron, the veteran coach quickly installed the 4-3. None of his four defensive linemen played together before, yet the line has been one of the team's strongest areas.

10. After three games, the Browns have only three turnovers -- two McCoy interceptions, one Hillis lost fumble. McCoy has been sacked only three times. While the offense has stalled at times, it has stayed away from giving the ball away.

11. Brian Robiskie has lost his playing time to Greg Little and Cribbs, and has yet to catch a pass. On a day when the passing game was suffering, it would have been nice to see a little more of Evan Moore. He did catch two passes, but was not on the field much.

12. Something to consider: The Browns have five touchdown passes. They had only 13 in 2010, 11 in 2009 and 11 in 2008. They are finding more ways to get the ball into the end zone.

Terry Pluto's postgame scribbles from Cleveland Browns-Miami Dolphins | cleveland.com

[Masters]

Originally Posted by Brown Warrior

I watched the game... and if you think McCoy was constantly under heat? He was scattershot because he didn't have time? You need a better television. That just wasn't the case, M.

He was under heat almost all game. That wasn't the only reason he was scattershot though (which I wasn't even talking about). He missed throws when he had time. My whole post was in response to you saying the pass protection was good. It wasn't. Good pass protection doesn't have your QB on his ass half the time or more. My TV is just fine, which is why I can see the RT getting backed up on top of the QB by the time he hits his 3rd step in a 3 step drop.

[golfer704u]

Here's my thoughts on the game.

KUDOS to Shumur and his staff. The won another game they should have won. They adjusted at halftime on offense and I think look better in the second half. And they won a close game a the end where this team usually finds a way to lose. A win's a win and they are all great.

Specifics.

McCoy himself admited he didn't throw the ball well a majority of the game. But BW to call the pass to Mo at the end a jump ball is one of the most ignorant things I have ever heard. That was a precision throw up and down to Mo in the only place he could catch it. If anything the first TD to Cribbs was more of a jump ball throw.

I agree with someone else who asked why we don't go no huddle more often. It definitely seems Colt is more comfortable in it. Does that also bode ill for Shumurs playcalling when we huddle?

The protection was just flat ugly. again , no huddle will help that. keep the defense on their heels a little.

And don't forget, while hardesty ran well, we were without our #1 offensive threat in Hillis. Especially catching the ball out of the backfield. Although we are on now what, OC 4 that seems to not like the screen pass as a playcall? what is with that?


ON the defense. I said before the game that Miami was a good match up for them. They have trouble scoring in the red zone and we bend but don't break.

I'm excited to see us 2-1 and the play of the defense is part of that. But I'll caution people like BW who think the defense is good and set now. Here is the list of QBs we played against this year so far. Andy Dalton, Bruce Gradkoswki, Kerry Collins, Chad Henne. If that was an answer on Jeoprody, the question would be "Name four NFL QBs who will likely be unemployed in three years."

The good news? we don't play a great QB until Nov 6. and actually only have 6 games against QBs that would be considered great this year. It could be a perfect storm for this defense and this team.

But overall, A win's a win and we are tied for the division lead!

[Vegasdogg]

I am not going to make excuses for either Shurmur or McCoy. I am not impressed with Shurmur right now. His offense is 30% "wow that was awesome" and 70% "oh come on WTF?"

But to say Colt was not pressured most of the day today? Rubbish. That pocket collapsed almost every pass.

If the criticism of Colt is he did not step UP and out, then you'd be on to something. But he was not pressured today? Huh? If it was Alex Smith you'd be talking about the pressure in 4 different threads.

[golfer704u]

Originally Posted by Vegasdogg

I am not going to make excuses for either Shurmur or McCoy. I am not impressed with Shurmur right now. His offense is 30% "wow that was awesome" and 70% "oh come on WTF?"

But to say Colt was not pressured most of the day today? Rubbish. That pocket collapsed almost every pass.

If the criticism of Colt is he did not step UP and out, then you'd be on to something. But he was not pressured today? Huh? If it was Alex Smith you'd be talking about the pressure in 4 different threads.

Are you a little worried that Shumur looks a little too much like Andy Reid in his playcalling? I am, but I also give him a slight pass this game with Hillis out.

and I don't mind critiquing Colt, but when the guy doing it calls is best pass of the day a "jump ball" it's rediculous.

[OconRecon]

How about Colt's post game accountability vs Mike Vick's whining? I like Colt's attitude, modesty, work ethic, etc.

I think the QB-receiver chemistry is about a month behind where is should be and it sure doesn't help our O line is not at all what we thought it would be.

But, I guess that should all be balanced out with our D line, who is starting to look rather beast. Mitchell and Miller look faster than any bookends we've seen in a while and Rubin + Taylor in the middle is awesome. D is giving up fewer and fewer points per game.

I'm pretty encouraged over all.

(of course, I'm also an ND fan, and you want to talk about ugly...)

[Masters]

Originally Posted by golfer704u

Are you a little worried that Shumur looks a little too much like Andy Reid in his playcalling? I am, but I also give him a slight pass this game with Hillis out.

and I don't mind critiquing Colt, but when the guy doing it calls is best pass of the day a "jump ball" it's rediculous.

It's funny you say that, as I was thinking the same thing. The play calling even with Hillis (see last week early on) looked exactly like an Andy Reid script. It has me worried to.

You think calling it a jump ball is rediculous, yesterday I saw it get called a bad throw by someone because MoMass had to jump as high as he can to catch it. It's exactly as you described it in your other post and exactly what a QB is to do when taking a shot at the endzone on 1st down with 43 seconds left. Put it where only your guy has a chance to get it.

[Brown Warrior]

Ocon, I was coming on to make that very point: I love that McCoy said he played like "garbage" most of the game. Good for him.

Note that even with the rotating RT, McCoy has been sacked 3 times all season, among the very lowest in the league. Sure, some of it's because he's mobile. A lot of it has been pretty damn good protection. The ugly jailbreaks? You don't run away from those.

Yesterday was a pretty good day for the line, period. McCoy even had a few of those pat-pat-pat-pat plays like Tom Brady or Aaron Rodgers. Haven't seen that in a million years for the Browns. If Pashos really is an upgrade over Hicks? We have an excellent offensive line.

Grossi did a good job of listing McCoy's uglier passes: The interception was literally a 5-yard miss, which is about the distance he overthrew a wide open Cribbs downfield. Threw behind Watson running free on a slant and Little on an out. Didn't mention that on the Jason Taylor offsides on the winning drive, he missed Cribbs on an intermediate slant with nobody within five yards of him. None of these were while being hit. It was what it was: 3.5 horrible quarters of passing. It was McCoy's second game under 50% in a short pass offense. For a guy with a business card that says ACCURATE? Not gonna cut it.

BUT... I'm not at all minimizing how important that last drive. It's one of McCoy's best qualities and I don't it off at all. He won me over more in a loss to the Jets than in the two big wins last year (where he threw for a combined 300 yards): That last drive in regulation was a thing of beauty. Some guys have that in them and some don't.

But I'm not one to struggle with feeling good about some things and bad about others. For instance: He really struggled throwing from the pocket, including batted down passes (something he'll have to solve as a shorter QB)... but the last TD WAS a pocket pass, and a beauty.

Sometimes it's about trusting your accuracy when your first quick hit isn't "college open." He often resets on his drops... and I think Shurmur would like some of those to come out. As Little gets more confident in what he's doing, he looks more and more explosive off the line and he and Massoquoi will be open on those first looks more.

EDIT: Noting McCoy's diminished accuracy so far this year, Alo wonders if it's the extra muscle. He may have to get used to it still.

[Masters]

Don't confuse sacks with being pressured. McCoy's mobility gets him out of a lot of the ugly pass protection we have seen. Of the 39 passes Colt threw yesterday if we went back and looked I bet we'd find him having to get up off his ass in about 20 of them. Pressure impacts any QBs accuracy. Not just getting hit, but when it keeps coming and you keep getting hit QBs, especially young/inexperienced ones get away from their mechanics and rush thows they don't need to rush. Colts got work to do, as does the entire O from the play calling down to the pass protection. We'll see a much closer finished product at years end.