I am sick of the excuses

[YtownBacker]

Originally Posted by Masters

Not to mention rush the ball, have a strong Oline, play good team D, and good STs play. It's hard for anything to be classic JJ since JJ's DAL success came pre-salary cap and the DAL team was loaded all over the field. The could beat you with run, pass, D, and ST.

Jerry Jones and Jimmy Johnson always said "you win the battle of the trenches and you win the game". Also, "Control the line of scrimmage and control the clock".

I don't know if that was before or after the "Pass the ball and rush the passer" remarks that they are noted for.

Did Jerry say Rush the passer and Jimmy Pass the ball or was it the other way around? I used to think way back then (before it was a passing league) they were saying, "run the ball and stop the run.

Man how time..................................you know

[Tobalaz]

Are we talking about the SAME Dallas that rode Emmit Smith to all of their Superbowl appearances?
The SAME Dallas team that couldn't win a game when said Smith held out for a bigger contract?

I feel like I woke up in bizzaro world.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Masters

It's hard for anything to be classic JJ since JJ's DAL success came pre-salary cap and the DAL team was loaded all over the field.

Which was 98% built via the draft. But anyways vintage J.J. you say? Well....

Vintage Jimmy Johnson gametime was to have Aikman and Irvin/Harper score quick a few times and get a lead. From there it was all on the D along with Emmitt and Moose to control the clock and dictate the game. Yeah I really have no clue where this fantasy that Dallas was a heavy passing team comes from. Dallas was like the 2001-2006 Pats that Brady rode to a dynasty, hard D and controlling the clock with the run.

As an aside vintage J.J. was also the exact same way of drafting that Belichick drafts, trading and trading and trading to have a large stockpile of picks each year. According to Johnson you can keep that deal going on forever and never have to actually rebuild.

[Masters]

Originally Posted by King of Kings

Which was 98% built via the draft. But anyways vintage J.J. you say? Well....

Vintage Jimmy Johnson gametime was to have Aikman and Irvin/Harper score quick a few times and get a lead. From there it was all on the D along with Emmitt and Moose to control the clock and dictate the game. Yeah I really have no clue where this fantasy that Dallas was a heavy passing team comes from. Dallas was like the 2001-2006 Pats that Brady rode to a dynasty, hard D and controlling the clock with the run.

As an aside vintage J.J. was also the exact same way of drafting that Belichick drafts, trading and trading and trading to have a large stockpile of picks each year. According to Johnson you can keep that deal going on forever and never have to actually rebuild.

98% was a stretch. But certainly their drafts played a huge part in those teams. But my point is they could land all the top FA they wanted/needed, and keep a hold of their core drafted talent, as they didn't have cap to worry about.

[Enigmatic Evil]

Originally Posted by Riffer X

Vickers was getting up there in age and was pretty much a one dimensional player, and if people remember, his snaps fell off last year, even with the philosophy of game management with Hillis.

Vickers was due to get paid if he stayed, quite a bit more than what a rookie makes, and that is a rookie involved on almost all the special teams. I always believed Vickers had better hands than people thought, but the fact remains he dropped or juggled a lot of big opportunity passes in his time here, and if you watched the video above, he did the same thing last week in Houston. They were down 8 late, and he dropped a pretty big possible TD if he catches it cleanly, he had pretty clear sailing to the goal.

I think a better argument is why did the Browns expend a fourth rounder on Owen? Vickers was considered about the all around best FB when he came out and he went in the sixth. Seems like the Browns fell in love with Owen for other things that maybe didn't equate to fourth round stature. He doesn't look all that impressive to me yet, but I think he will get better with he speed of the game and his work ethic. He actually has played better than the naked eye sees, I think. In the Colts game he sprung Hillis for both his TD's.

I just see it as a non-issue, just another move teams make to save on cap and get younger.

Marecic has up-side. As with any rookie adjusting to the NFL game, he's made his share of rookie mistakes to date and has lacked consistency with big blocks, as well as his overall game. He's dropped some pretty matchable passes and sometimes his play lacks intensity on the field. I think he'll grow with maturity and familiarity of the NFL game but there are certain consistencies that he doesn't bring to play every snap it seems.

Vickers was consistent in one element of his play, that's what Brown's fans liked about Vickers. There was an interview with Vickers where he sounded so enthusiastic about run blocking. It's the kind of thing that really endears you to the fans and there was a genuine attitude toward it. Vickers was a hard player to dislike, really. With Owen, we've yet to see Marecic hit any level of true consistency, it's grating at times to take a step back and see it affect the game. I think the bigger picture with Marecic is that he will evolve into a more 'complete' player compared to Vickers... who's play was rather one-dimensional. Time will tell, he's got a lot of games ahead of him in the season alone.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Masters

98% was a stretch. But certainly their drafts played a huge part in those teams. But my point is they could land all the top FA they wanted/needed, and keep a hold of their core drafted talent, as they didn't have cap to worry about.

Drafted Players on Jimmy Johnsons roster in his final year-
Troy Aikman
Emmitt Smith
Daryl Johnston
Alvin Harper
Michael Irvin
Mark Tuinea
Nate Newton
Mark Stepnoski
Kevin Gogan
Erik Williams
Tony Tolbert
Russel Maryland
Leon Lett
Dixon Edwards
Ken Norton
Darrin Smith
Kevin R. Smith
Larry Brown
Darren Woodson
John Jett
Kevin Williams
Bill Bates
Lincoln Coleman
Lin Elliott
Kenneth Gant
Jason Garrett
Chris Hall
Chad Hennings
Jim Jeffcoat
Jimmie Jones
Robert Jones
Derrik Lasic
Brock Marion
Godfrey Myles
Dave Thomas(Founder of Wendy's)
Robert Williams


Free Agents:
Jay Novacek
Tony Cassilas(Backup)
Charles Haley
Thomas Everette(Backup)
Eddie Murray(Kicker)
Tommy Agee(3rd RB)
Kelly Blackwell(Backup)
Frank Cornish(Backup)
Joe Fishback(Backup)
Derrik Gainer(Backup)
Scott Gailbraith(Backup)
John Gesek(Backup)
Dale Hellestrae(Backup)
Bernie Kosar(Smart affordable backup)
Joe Mickey(Offseason/Practice Squad)
Elvis Patterson(Backup)
Jim Price(Backup)
John Roper(Backup)
Matt Vanderbeek(Backup straight from Dawson's Creek)
James Washington
Tyrone Williams(4th/5th WR AKA Backup)

98% may be a stretch although not by much when it comes to free agent starters(3), only two of which were considered top tier and one came via trade(Haley), not spending out the ass(Dallas let him walk once his contract was up).

Anyways I only pointed that out because there's this whole myth that's been bandied about for the last decade or so years that Jimmy Johnson essentially "bought" his dynasty via paying massive contracts to free agency and that really does the man and his legacy a disservice. Aside from 3 FA starters and a handful of Tom Landry holdovers on the O/D Lines and Special Teams the talented core of his dynasty was young guys drafted and coached up by him on their rookie contracts. The free agent spending spree didn't start until he was fired for winning too many Superbowl's. Would he have started spending big money had he stayed? That's hard to say, i'm sure his core of guys would have been paid but he drafted so well he didn't really need to sign many free agencies aside from camp bodies, backup depth and street free agents when players fell to injury.

[Vegasdogg]

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Evil

His run blocking abilities have been missed though

Someone is going to have to show me on the film how this is true. You can't talk raw figures/stats because the scheme is new and the use of the pass vs run is different.

How is this offense missing a blocking FB when most of the plays don't involve the FB, and the stupid ass short yardage playcalls never use the damn FB anyway.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Riffer X

Vintage Vickers drop last week....

NFL Game Center: Oakland Raiders at Houston Texans - 2011 Week 5

Well done Riff. Now that it's flag football today - this guy is a waste of time as is Marecic. Play Hillis and Hardesty together and give either one a breather for Armond Smith.

[Brown Warrior]

It was a specific quote from Johnson, and he said it several times: You build a team around the quarterback and defensive line. He was a 4-3 coach, of course, but he liked to have depth on the DL and knew he couldn't win without one of the league's best QBs, at least not over time.

It holds up and, somewhat ironically, makes even more sense in this pass-happy era. If you can throw the rock and disrupt the opposing passer? You're gonna win in this league.