The MYTH of SF's Offense

[DawgFan]

Everyone keeps talking (at least the mainstream media) about how great the SF offense is and how the Browns just don't match up. So I decided to take a "deeper" look.

Here is what I found:

They are 27^th on offense (Browns 23^rd)
They are 31^st passing (Browns are 22^nd)
They are 6^th rushing (Browns are 29^th)
They are 24^th in 1^st Downs (Browns are 15^th)
They are 27^th on 3^rd Down Conversions (Browns are 9^th)
So offensively, the Browns are better in 5 of the 6 categories above.

The big reason the 49ers are scoring so many points is defensive takeaways and special teams scores. Ginn already has 2 TD's via kickoff/punt returns. They have scored another TD via a pass INT. The fact is that they are among the leaders in the NFL in takeaways (15) and have the top ST's in the NFL, so you can see where the points are coming from.

With the Browns now owning the 4th ranked defense, including the top ranked passing defense, Alex Smith is going to have a very long day. If the Browns can just protect the ball (as they have all year with only 6 turnovers), and they can hold their own against Seely and their special teams play...they have a legit chance of winning.

Just as an extra aside, they are ranked 11th on defense, but 22nd vs the pass and are prone to give up the big play.

[Vegasdogg]

I will say this Dawg, they get timely scores. Their D gives them just enough time to keep a lead or get back in a game. They play complimentary football, and they have beat teams with all 3 aspects. They don't kick your ass in any of the 3 phases of the game, they're just steady. Team chemistry goes a long way IMO.

But you're right man, we should not fear anything about these guys. They're not cupcakes but it isn't as if they've been dominating like the Stoolers, Ravens, Colts or Pats.

Good post. It is nice to bring an opponent down to Earth sometimes.

[Sez.EJ]

Those numbers are a bit decieving too. They are an excellent rushing team. 6th as noted. That does not bode will with our 27th rank in rushing yards per game. Gore is averaging 7.8 per carry.. WOW

The reason they are so low on first downs.. They are 3rd in turnover ratio. They get short fields due to the defense so a lot of the drives are very short. They are second in points given up, and have not given up even ONE rushing TD yet.

No team has scored more efficiently than the 49ers. San Francisco has produced a meager 1,815 yards of offense. But it has still managed to hang 167 points on the scoreboard. That's an incredible 10.87 Yards Per Point Scored. In other words, the 49ers are good for about one point with each first down.

In the context of touchdowns, San Francisco's opponents need 145.3 yards of offense to put 7 points on the board.

The passing game is mediocre.. I agree with that..but the defense and running game vault them to a superior status.. The QB only needs to manage the game.. San Fran is a playoff team. They won't go anywhere due to the limitations of the QB ..but they will make the playoffs.

[DawgFan]

Originally Posted by Sez.EJ

Those numbers are a bit decieving too. They are an excellent rushing team. 6th as noted. That does not bode will with our 27th rank in rushing yards per game. Gore is averaging 7.8 per carry.. WOW

The reason they are so low on first downs.. They are 3rd in turnover ratio. They get short fields due to the defense so a lot of the drives are very short. They are second in points given up, and have not given up even ONE rushing TD yet.

No team has scored more efficiently than the 49ers. San Francisco has produced a meager 1,815 yards of offense. But it has still managed to hang 167 points on the scoreboard. That's an incredible 10.87 Yards Per Point Scored. In other words, the 49ers are good for about one point with each first down.

In the context of touchdowns, San Francisco's opponents need 145.3 yards of offense to put 7 points on the board.

The passing game is mediocre.. I agree with that..but the defense and running game vault them to a superior status.. The QB only needs to manage the game.. San Fran is a playoff team. They won't go anywhere due to the limitations of the QB ..but they will make the playoffs.

Sez, their passing D is not all that, like I said, 22nd. That does not bode well for the long haul. So far, they have won on smoke and mirrors, and with Alex Smith with the fewest attempts of ALL FULL TIME STARTERS. In other words, in a passing league, they are shaky on both sides of the ball in that category.

I see the rushing stats, but the fact is that the top 4 RUSHING OFFENSES are 11-15 combined, and the top 4 RUSHING DEFENSES are a combined 13-12. Compare that to the stats I showed on another thread of the TOP PASSING OFFENSE/DEFENSE teams (20-6 and 16-9 respectively) and you can see the way this will likely go in the long run.

So far, SF has had everything go right, and they have escaped with wins on perfect bounces of the ball. The Browns have half the luck they did and we would be 5-1 too.

That efficiency stat is nothing more than stating that they score on short fields, i.e., they have a great ST's unit and turn the ball over. Nothing to do with offense.

[next2nothing]

They're going to pound the ball early with Gore. If the Browns can shut down Gore and force Alex "Still a Bust" Smith to actually beat them instead of be a game manager, the Browns have a good chance of beating them.

[Sez.EJ]

What they are doing on defense is not luck. They have draft after draft of talent on the D side of the ball. The running game is not luck either. They look worse in defensive passing stats because they play with a lead..so teams have to pass..so that bumps those stats. Teams who can't run on them and are playing from behing..naturally pass more..so that bumps the stats to make them look worse than they are. They are actually very good.

They have the 8th most passing attempts againt them, and the second in the fewest rushing attempts against them. Can't run; gotta pass. One feeds the other..so the pass defense statistically looks worse than it is.

They are #2 in rush defense. Have not given up a single rushing TD.. They are tied for 4th in passing TD's given up with 9...

I agree that Alex Smith is the weak link.. but when you have a great run game, short fields, and great defense.. He does not have to do much.. We have to force him into mistakes when he does pass.

The key is.. can we score?? I have my doubts.

[Masters]

SF pass D is also near the top of the league in sackes and INTs. Their pass D is not as weak as the passing y/g stat makes it appear (as Sez is pointing out).

Gore though is not averaging 7.8 y/c. He is averaging 5 y/c. That stat is padded based on him going against TB, PHI, and DET. All of which have worse rush D's than CLE. Not that it means CLE will stop Gore as their rush D hasn't been the best.

[Masters]

SF has not really been playing from ahead most of the season, so that isn't the main reason for the few rush attempts against them. Half the teams SF has played are in the bottom half of the league in rushing yards, rushing attempts, and rushing TDs

[DawgFan]

Rushing average against:

SF 3.6/yc
Cleveland 3.9/yc

I think that you may have it wrong...the Browns have played teams with poor QB's so they have rushed a lot, although not really with a TON of success as we have the 9th best y/c against in the NFL.

Meanwhile, SF has played teams with good passing games and poor rushing games, and only average .3 y/c less than the Browns.

Tell me out of these teams who has a good RB?
Seattle - ranked 31st (we held them to less than SF)
Dallas - ranked 12th, but only after that rookie tore it up for 253 last week
Cincinnati - ranked 21st (we held them to less)
Philadelphia - ranked #1 and got them for over 100 yards and over 5 y/c
Tampa Bay - ranked 22nd
Detroit - ranked 27th

So, the only team that runs the ball well that they faced put over 100 on them in only 20 carries, and is known as a passing first team.

I am not saying we can run on them, but I am saying that even their running game is over rated.

[BernietheKid]

Browns-49ers Preview
		By Don Delco OBR Browns Reporter Posted Oct 29, 2011 The Browns need to keep it simple Sunday against the 5-1 San Francisco 49ers: Score a touchdown or two. 0 Comments
For a team that is – once again – going through a rebuilding process, the goals must be kept simple. The Cleveland Browns, who are at .500 for the first time since 2007, travel west to play San Francisco 49ers at 4:15 p.m. on Sunday. The Browns need achieve a simple goal Sunday. Score a touchdown. Rumor has it the Browns have done this previously during the 2011 season. In fact, the last time it happened there was 1 minute, 6 seconds remaining in the game against Oakland on Oct. 16. Quarterback Colt McCoy found Mohamed Massaquoi for a 12-yard touchdown pass. That’s the good news. Here’s the bad news. The Browns lost the game against Oakland 24-17. The following week, the Browns beat Seattle 6-3, thanks to two 50-plus-yard field goals from Phil Dawson. Cleveland finished that game without its best running back (Peyton Hillis-hamstring), its best tight end (Ben Watson-concussion) and arguably its best wide receiver (Massaquoi). A little luck and a little grit gave the Browns the victory, as they are one-game out of first place in the AFC North behind Pittsburgh (5-2), Baltimore (4-2) and Cincinnati (4-2). The 49ers are not the Seahawks. San Francisco will be a real test for this young Browns team. The 49ers have won four consecutive games to improve to 5-1. Those four wins have come against the Cincinnati Bengals, Philadelphia Eagles, Tampa Bay Buccaneers and the Detroit Lions, teams that are a combined 15-11. Massaquoi will not play while Hillis and Watson were listed as questionable on Friday. Even with those three aforementioned players, the Browns offense has struggled this season. Cleveland is ranked 29th in rushing yards per game (91.5), 22nd in pass yard per game (216.8) and 23rd in total yard per game (308.3). Meanwhile, the 49ers defense has been stout. Only once has an opponent rushed for more than 100 yards, as the 49ers are ranked second in the league against the run allowing an average of 74.7 yards a game. “(The 49ers have) big bodies up front and athletic linebackers,” Hillis said. “The linemen take all the pressure off the linebackers and of course you have one of the best linebackers in the league if not the best defensive player in Patrick Willis. That’s probably why they do so well.” Last week, the Browns ran the ball 44 times for 141 yards, which is a 3.2 yards per carry average. The 49ers expect more of the same from the Browns, whose offense is beginning to do its best Woody Hayes impression. The Browns need to start getting vertical. “I’d like us to become a team that can (run and pass) well,” Shurmur said. “When I talk about throwing the ball we need to be efficient and that’s get completions. In our style of offense, regardless of how you choose to run the football, you should be able to be very good at running it as well.” McCoy finished 20-for-35 passing for 178 yards with no touchdowns and a head-scratching interception. It wasn’t McCoy’s worst game, but considering the Browns finished with four field goal attempts and not touchdowns, end result wasn’t pretty. Thankfully, the 2011 Browns have an improving defense and it has kept this team in games. The Browns are currently ranked fourth in the NFL in total defensive yards per game (291.0), second in passing yards per game (172.0) and 19th in rushing yards (119.0). There are two schools of thought as to why the Browns defense has played so well. One, the last two drafts have resulted in talented defensive players contributing right away. Two, the list of opposing quarterbacks the Browns have faced this season are among the league’s worst. Andy Dalton/Bruce Gradkowski Kerry Collins Chad Henne Jason Campbell/Kyle Boller Charlie Whitehurst This week it’s Alex Smith. He hasn’t lived up to his No. 1 overall status, but he has had a re-emergence this year under first-year coach Jim Harbaugh. Smith is 100-for-158 passing for 1,090 yards with eight touchdowns and two interceptions, which is thanks, in part, to targets like tight end Vernon Davis and Michael Crabtree. In addition, the 49ers running game is led by Frank Gore (5.0 yards per carry average). “They run the ball quite a bit and the things they’re asking (Smith) to do, he’s able to do,” Shurmur said. “It’s a credit to what Jim (Harbaugh) has done with that team and they’re playing well. They’ve got talented players, I think they’ve got eight first rounders on offense so they have talented players and a good scheme. They’ve got the quarterback playing at a high level and that makes him very dangerous.” All this ads up to a game in which the Browns should not and are not expected to win. It’s kind of like last season when the Browns had no business beating New England or New Orleans. It’s why we watch every game. Scout.com: Browns-49ers Preview

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by DawgFan

Sez, their passing D is not all that, like I said, 22nd. That does not bode well for the long haul. So far, they have won on smoke and mirrors,.

I think Detroit didn't fully know what they were up against until they were up against SF's D. They challenged EVERY pass including Willis wrestling for the ball with Pettigrew on a TD play the TE had ZERO seperation on. I've seen bits and pieces of them each week and they're pretty damn good Dawgfan. There are some VERY talented corners on that D.

They dusted somebody by a 48-3 margin and I think the losing QB got credited for about 320 yards passing so it's hard to hold that against their defense IMO.

[hiwaygal]

The 49'ers suck great big hairy dirty donkey balls!


GO BROWNS!!!!



I just wanted to post something in this thread! lol