Veikune?

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Solon16

When you state that a Guy who was simply let go by the dolphins is our best linebacker and then say we have depth........is not.......Good!

You're about the first one to tell me you're unhappy with Roth but you're entitled to your opinion on that. I don't think I've ever seen our D swarm Worthlessberger the way we did down the stretch.

I think some of us are spending too much time worrying about Veikune while forgetting GOOD stories like Marcus Benard, Trusnik and the rejuvenation of Roth. Now we added Fujita to team up with Bowens and others here. 365 days ago the LBer position was a nightmare here and we only had 4 draft picks looking at that inheritance for our new head Coach. I think we've more than baby-stepped this position to solid and reliable. We've got 12 picks so there may be another LBer coming but it's not nearly as urgent as last year heading into the draft.
- Tom F.

[Solon16]

Did I say unhappy? I'm just saying You think our best LB is a guy we got off the street doesn't say much to the quality we have, right?

[Dan in Florida]

This is WHY LB Matt Roth was made available to the Browns. I live in South Florida and he pissed off Parcels.

Per Sun Sentinel Newspaper (South Florida):

Rosenhaus and another client, linebacker Matt Roth, butted heads with the Dolphins last year over the player’s desire for a contract extension and a later decision to stash Roth on the reserve/non-football injury list for the season’s first six weeks.
Roth was waived in November and landed with the Cleveland Browns, for whom he was highly productive over the final six games.

Miami Dolphins : Miami Dolphins: Ricky Williams hires Drew Rosenhaus | Sun-Sentinel.com

There's alot more to the wierd brake down between the Dolphins and Roth, if you want to know why the talented guy became available to us (read below):

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Solon16

Did I say unhappy? I'm just saying You think our best LB is a guy we got off the street doesn't say much to the quality we have, right?

I don't get how that stopped him from getting a sack in 4 straight games and improving our LBer play on the outside.

I think I pretty much explained why I feel LBer became the most improved area on the team. I disagree with those thinking Veikune HAS to pan out or we're in trouble. And the reason I would say such a thing is because we have alot of guys that can play inside or outside. Aside from that, while Veikune isn't an early success per say - an undrafted LBer like Marcus Benard showed us a wow factor you want to see in a young LBer. Hopefully, that wow gets even more consistent as he gets more experience.

When we can get rid of Wimbley and we don't have plans for Barton and we're not sure about extending a raise to Jackson - isn't that a little evidence we've raised the bar in the last 365 days?

If you want to tell me Bowens and Fujita are in their 30s like Bernie-the-kid brought to my attention - it's a VERY good point I wasn't even considering. We've got 12 picks so noone says we don't have to draft a LBer. It's just that other areas of the team have less depth and overall talent at this time to make me think it's as urgent as last year.

I know you're a McClain fan and think you have very good taste with that. He's a stud that plays fast and I adore the 6'4" frame and 260 pounds. There's a considerable dropoff in talent between him and Brandon Spikes. PSU's Sean Lee has prolly leapfrogged ahead of Spikes after the dreadful 5.01 forty time.
- Tom F.

[NW Ohio Brownie]

When you look at the bigger picture, it's easy to see the obvious: Mangini and Ryan were able to take average, scrap heap guys and turn them into viable contributors. This is a Veikune thread and we've talked about Bowens, Roth, Trusnik, Maiava, and Benard.

That's why we shouldn't be scratching our heads about the Wimbley trade. Kam had a good year for us, no doubt, but when you look at how everybody else stepped up their game at LB it should make you realize what's at work here. It also means DQJ could have one foot out the door, too.

Look, these guys were largely responsible for us being in the top ten in '09 in getting heat on the opposing QB. Which cinches the idea that we desperately need playmakers in our back four.

For those of you that don't think that's the highest priority on this team, here's some sobering images from '09:
1) Antonio Gates vs. Mike Furrey in a one-on-one jump ball scenario
2) Hank Poteat in our nickel coverages
3) Charlie Frye goes for 300 . . . in December . . . in Cleveland
4) Matthew Stafford and Matt Cassel getting the snot knocked out of them by our LBs but still managing to combine for nearly 800 yards in the air against our D

Yes, our passing game sucks. But, we can run the football and run it well. But on defense there is no chance we are going to get off the field on third down consistently without two more studs in our defensive backfield. Period.

[Enigmatic Evil]

Originally Posted by NW Ohio Brownie

When you look at the bigger picture, it's easy to see the obvious: Mangini and Ryan were able to take average, scrap heap guys and turn them into viable contributors. This is a Veikune thread and we've talked about Bowens, Roth, Trusnik, Maiava, and Benard.

That's why we shouldn't be scratching our heads about the Wimbley trade. Kam had a good year for us, no doubt, but when you look at how everybody else stepped up their game at LB it should make you realize what's at work here. It also means DQJ could have one foot out the door, too.

Look, these guys were largely responsible for us being in the top ten in '09 in getting heat on the opposing QB. Which cinches the idea that we desperately need playmakers in our back four.

For those of you that don't think that's the highest priority on this team, here's some sobering images from '09:
1) Antonio Gates vs. Mike Furrey in a one-on-one jump ball scenario
2) Hank Poteat in our nickel coverages
3) Charlie Frye goes for 300 . . . in December . . . in Cleveland
4) Matthew Stafford and Matt Cassel getting the snot knocked out of them by our LBs but still managing to combine for nearly 800 yards in the air against our D

Yes, our passing game sucks. But, we can run the football and run it well. But on defense there is no chance we are going to get off the field on third down consistently without two more studs in our defensive backfield. Period.

+1 Great Post.

I feel like I've been one of the only people who gave a damn about our completely inept secondary while the rest of the board was arguing over whether or not Brady Quinn's shit was too legit to quit on.

Our secondary was terrible, the only player we have back there worth even thinking about in a positive light is Eric Wright and he really isn't the kind of player that gives offensive coordinators bad dreams. He's a solid corner back that would probably be a #2 on most NFL defenses. He's great for us, which is why he's valuable and he should continue to get better as he reaches his prime.

Some of you have sold yourself on Abe Elam... I don't think so, he's a solution for the 2010 year tops, we need to improve him.

Our Linebacker core is very underrated, even among our fans. I think we got performance out of players like Trusnik, Bernard and Maiava beyond that of which any of us expected. When Matt Roth came in "off the street" he instantly IMPROVED our defense. That didn't just happen, his play made our defense better because he is a good player. I don't think Veikune is a "make-or-break" player for us like say, MoMass or even Robo, Veikune is very expendable.

That's why I think its important for players like Veikune, (and Robiskie, really) to make a big impact in the pre-season. They're second year guys, they are more familiar with the system and they're in a position that they can step up and be contributors to this team. Or they can languish on the bench and wait for their opportunities. I think our team will be very competitive next year, not a WINNER, not yet, but competitive. That comes from young players like Veikune, playing hard, earning their spots and playing hard on the field as well.

I'm excited for next season as the landscape of our team continues to unfold.

[BernietheKid]

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Evil

+1 Great Post.

I feel like I've been one of the only people who gave a damn about our completely inept secondary while the rest of the board was arguing over whether or not Brady Quinn's shit was too legit to quit on.

Our secondary was terrible, the only player we have back there worth even thinking about in a positive light is Eric Wright and he really isn't the kind of player that gives offensive coordinators bad dreams. He's a solid corner back that would probably be a #2 on most NFL defenses. He's great for us, which is why he's valuable and he should continue to get better as he reaches his prime.

Some of you have sold yourself on Abe Elam... I don't think so, he's a solution for the 2010 year tops, we need to improve him.

Our Linebacker core is very underrated, even among our fans. I think we got performance out of players like Trusnik, Bernard and Maiava beyond that of which any of us expected. When Matt Roth came in "off the street" he instantly IMPROVED our defense. That didn't just happen, his play made our defense better because he is a good player. I don't think Veikune is a "make-or-break" player for us like say, MoMass or even Robo, Veikune is very expendable.

That's why I think its important for players like Veikune, (and Robiskie, really) to make a big impact in the pre-season. They're second year guys, they are more familiar with the system and they're in a position that they can step up and be contributors to this team. Or they can languish on the bench and wait for their opportunities. I think our team will be very competitive next year, not a WINNER, not yet, but competitive. That comes from young players like Veikune, playing hard, earning their spots and playing hard on the field as well.

I'm excited for next season as the landscape of our team continues to unfold.

Good Stuff EE! That's why we didn't resign Pool either because he was overrated. I don't know how many times I saw Pool or Elam out of position during a game. Yet everyone around here talked themselves into thinking he was a good player because he had four picks this year. I agree with you on Elam. He is a backup at best and our secondary needs three new starters. As far as Wright goes he doesn't scare any DC but he is very functional, and could be a good #2 on any other team in the league.

[Vegasdogg]

Originally Posted by Shep

"It's better to have a gun and not need it, than need a gun and not have it."

If it's Dodge City in 1860. But now the reverse is actually true, because virtually nobody really "needs" a gun... so it can only do harm to self, family, and friends. Which is mostly what they're used for.

That's smart, discuss gun control in a LB thread. Moron. And you're in the minority in your thinking.

[RPrepublic]

so it can only do harm to self, family, and friends. Which is mostly what they're used for.

Really? and here i thought they were mostly used for hunting, target shooting, and home protection.

The 31 states that have "shall issue" laws allowing private citizens to carry concealed weapons have, on average, a 24 percent lower violent crime rate, a 19 percent lower murder rate and a 39 percent lower robbery rate than states that forbid concealed weapons. In fact, the nine states with the lowest violent crime rates are all right-to-carry states. Remarkably, guns are used for self-defense more than 2 million times a year, three to five times the estimated number of violent crimes committed with guns.

And i would really like to see Maiava and Veikune develop more as im more impressed with the Maiava who was a 4th rounder. Either way we are much better comming into this year than we were comming into last year.

[Vegasdogg]

Originally Posted by RPrepublic

Remarkably, guns are used for self-defense more than 2 million times a year, three to five times the estimated number of violent crimes committed with guns. .

Sig line material right there.

Maiava, Veikune, and Hall can all learn how to succeed in this system. They always talk about fits and gaps in this defense, and when those are missed there are big gains. Ryan and Mangini can teach this defense to play well without having the need for an underachiever like Kam Wimbley on the team. We still need help at LB, but that 3rd is worth more than seeing Kam leavie here after next season while piling up another 4 sack season.

Veikune is still in the mix, but I am not sure where right now, because I don't know what he has been working on this offseason.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Enigmatic Evil

+1 Great Post.

I feel like I've been one of the only people who gave a damn about our completely inept secondary while the rest of the board was arguing over whether or not Brady Quinn's shit was too legit to quit on.

Our secondary was terrible, the only player we have back there worth even thinking about in a positive light is Eric Wright and he really isn't the kind of player that gives offensive coordinators bad dreams. He's a solid corner back that would probably be a #2 on most NFL defenses. He's great for us, which is why he's valuable and he should continue to get better as he reaches his prime.

Some of you have sold yourself on Abe Elam... I don't think so, he's a solution for the 2010 year tops, we need to improve him.

Our Linebacker core is very underrated, even among our fans. I think we got performance out of players like Trusnik, Bernard and Maiava beyond that of which any of us expected. When Matt Roth came in "off the street" he instantly IMPROVED our defense. That didn't just happen, his play made our defense better because he is a good player. I don't think Veikune is a "make-or-break" player for us like say, MoMass or even Robo, Veikune is very expendable.

That's why I think its important for players like Veikune, (and Robiskie, really) to make a big impact in the pre-season. They're second year guys, they are more familiar with the system and they're in a position that they can step up and be contributors to this team. Or they can languish on the bench and wait for their opportunities. I think our team will be very competitive next year, not a WINNER, not yet, but competitive. That comes from young players like Veikune, playing hard, earning their spots and playing hard on the field as well.

I'm excited for next season as the landscape of our team continues to unfold.

Very good insights E! NW Ohio Brownie brought up some very interesting realities about our secondary. We'll address this area alot more this year IMO. Last year we tackled the LBer position and then did it again with Fujita so we can focus more on dline and secondary as well as needs on offense.
- Tom F.