Irsay GETS IT, Why can't Lerner?

[King of Kings]

Colts clean house: Polians are out Posted by Gregg Rosenthal on January 2, 2012, 2:39 PM EST
AP

We have our first stunner of Black Monday.
Colts Vice Chairman Bill Polian and his son G.M. Chris Polian are out in Indianapolis, according to Chris Mortensen of ESPN.


There’s no official word yet on coach Jim Caldwell. (UPDATE 2:59 p.m. ET: No decision has been made yet on Caldwell, according to Bob Kravitz of the Indianapolis Star.)
The departure of the Polian clan is a seismic decision by owner Jim Irsay after 14 years of success with the Colts franchise. Bill Polian took over as G.M. in early 1998 and made Peyton Manning his first draft pick with the team.


Polian dumped quarterback Jim Harbaugh back then and it’s at least possible that his plans regarding Manning led to this move by Irsay.


Irsay is very close to Manning and there was apparent friction between the quarterback and general manager in recent weeks. Polian seemed almost certain to draft a quarterback No. 1 and had been closely tied to Andrew Luck, who yet another Polian worked with at Stanford.


It’s possible the next Colts decision maker could still let go of Manning or draft Luck, of course. But the departure of the Polians appears to make it more likely for Manning to have a future in Indianapolis.


Until this disastrous year, the Colts had won at least ten games for nine straight seasons. The team had eleven double digit win seasons in Polian’s tenure.


Of course, Polian’s tenure coincides exactly with Peyton Manning. There are fair arguments to be made over how much credit Manning should get and how much the front office should get.


We think there is enough credit to go around. The Polians and Manning accomplished an incredible amount together.


Irsay sure appears to see Manning as the more integral part of the Colts’ future.

Must be nice. As an aside if I were Lerner I would be on the phone with Bill and Chris Polian RIGHT FREAKIN' NOW and if they would agree to come here i'd show H&H and their rejects the goddamn door soon as I hung up the phone. BTW, see bolded: Manning is still THE shotcaller in Indy and it appears they'll be trying to move the #1 overall pick. Seriously, let's get the Polians and Andrew Luck into Cleveland, Randy. PLEASE!

[next2nothing]

Nothing like this will remotely happen.

Lerner is scared and or too laid back with this organization to fire the "great" Mike Holmgren and the coaches won't be going anywhere as long as Mike is in the office.

Fuckin hell. Fuck this franchise sometimes.

[King of Kings]

Unfortunately true, I just wanted to highlight that the Colts thanks to Manning's ego just dropped THE golden ticket into Lerner's lap if he had balls enough to take it. A ready made PROVEN success of a front office available for hire and we're going to pass. Think the Rams pass up on it? I doubt it.

[next2nothing]

I don't care about hiring the Polians honestly. If anything they kind of showed that they aren't as great at getting guys as people are led to believe, given that once Manning went down that team couldn't win more than 2 games. Not to say they aren't successful but there is something to be said about a team that loses one man and all of a sudden is the NFL's worst team.

What I was getting at more is the fact that Irsay, no matter how many years the Polians worked for him and the success that the Colts had over 10 years, knew it was time to dump them and did it. Lerner, who doesn't owe shit to Holmgren or Shurmur, will let this circus of a team go into next year and all we fans can do is pray that they somehow "get it".

I didn't see all negative but I really believe that all we're doing is delaying the inevitable. Holmgren and Shurmur won't last here and we'll be looking for a new HC, yet again.

[Sez.EJ]

Polian is the idiot who for 10+ years never had an adequate backup who could win on a playoff caliber team behind Manning.. He's no genius. He drafted Manning. I could look like a genius too if I was lucky enough to draft Manning..The rest of his team has just been OK.. Manning makes WR's look great.. Not Polian... OK, my calling him an idiot is too harsh.. but pretty much every other contender keeps a backup who has a CLUE as a backup..he never has..and it finally bit him this year. IMO he's been lucky this has not been exposed earlier.

Look at his defensive drafting.. This team has stacked up defensive picks for a decade and that D has always been the weakness on the team. He's drafted a bunch of average OL guys with high picks too in recent years.
I'll stick with Heckert.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by King of Kings

Must be nice. As an aside if I were Lerner I would be on the phone with Bill and Chris Polian RIGHT FREAKIN' NOW and if they would agree to come here i'd show H&H and their rejects the goddamn door soon as I hung up the phone. BTW, see bolded: Manning is still THE shotcaller in Indy and it appears they'll be trying to move the #1 overall pick. Seriously, let's get the Polians and Andrew Luck into Cleveland, Randy. PLEASE!

The irony here is Bill Polian has a son on the offensive coaching staff of Stanford pertaining to Andrew Luck. The Manning family has been VERY vocal they don't want Andrew Luck. WOW! This is gigantic news!

Which side of the Atlantic Ocean is Randy on today? Is he anywhere near Cleveland or is he off sky-diving or trying a new hobby somewhere he doesn't want to be found again?

With our luck, Mike Brown already has him under contract. Yaaa, THE Mike Brown that has Cincy in the playoffs and just gave the Oakland Raiders a bunch of quick sand in exchange for a lot of GOOD draft picks ahead.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by next2nothing

I don't care about hiring the Polians honestly. If anything they kind of showed that they aren't as great at getting guys as people are led to believe, given that once Manning went down that team couldn't win more than 2 games. Not to say they aren't successful but there is something to be said about a team that loses one man and all of a sudden is the NFL's worst team.

They were the fall guys, nothing more. Irsay was truly transparent all season about his love for Andrew Luck. It didn't take a rocket scientist to figure out he wanted the Colts to be in position to draft the "next Peyton Manning." Unfortunately for him he lacks balls and when push came to shove he needed someone to feed to Manning. So far that someone was Bill and his son Chris. They're as good as they're advertised as I promise that.

The reason I say Irsay gets it is because someone DID need to be fed to the Lion, changes DID need to be made within that organization irregardless. I wouldn't go so far as saying it needed to be in the front office, moreso the coaching staff but he's certainly making changes likely across the board.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Sez.EJ

Polian is the idiot who for 10+ years never had an adequate backup who could win on a playoff caliber team behind Manning.. He's no genius. He drafted Manning. I could look like a genius too if I was lucky enough to draft Manning..The rest of his team has just been OK.. Manning makes WR's look great.. Not Polian... OK, my calling him an idiot is too harsh.. but pretty much every other contender keeps a backup who has a CLUE as a backup..he never has..and it finally bit him this year. IMO he's been lucky this has not been exposed earlier.

Look at his defensive drafting.. This team has stacked up defensive picks for a decade and that D has always been the weakness on the team. He's drafted a bunch of average OL guys with high picks too in recent years.
I'll stick with Heckert.

LMAO keep spinning Sez. Terrific Tom couldn't lace either Polian's shoes when it comes to this NFL thang. He can fetch coffee and doughnuts for lardass Andy Reid like no other though.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Flugel

The irony here is Bill Polian has a son on the offensive coaching staff of Stanford pertaining to Andrew Luck. The Manning family has been VERY vocal they don't want Andrew Luck. WOW! This is gigantic news!

Which side of the Atlantic Ocean is Randy on today? Is he anywhere near Cleveland or is he off sky-diving or trying a new hobby somewhere he doesn't want to be found again?

With our luck, Mike Brown already has him under contract. Yaaa, THE Mike Brown that has Cincy in the playoffs and just gave the Oakland Raiders a bunch of quick sand in exchange for a lot of GOOD draft picks ahead.

Funny you mention that Flugel, I just said to N2N in a PM 5 minutes ago "watch, with our luck Mike Brown has decided to retire as President/GM and is working to bring the Polians in to take over."

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

Originally Posted by King of Kings

Seriously, let's get the Polians and Andrew Luck into Cleveland, Randy. PLEASE!

From your keyboard to Gods ears.

Hiring Mike Holmgren may turn out to be one of the worst decisions ever made for the Cleveland Browns. First, we fire the best coach we have had here by a long shot since Marty in year two of a 5 year contract. And really he only ever had one year of coaching without Mike skulking over his shoulder. Then we summarily dismiss ANY idea of going after Harbaugh or any other coach worth a shit in lieu of Mike's nephew. And now when we have a real opportunity to make a no brainer homerun of a FO hire ...there's no way in hell it will happen.


Only in Cleveland.

Truly discouraging.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Sez.EJ

Polian is the idiot who for 10+ years never had an adequate backup who could win on a playoff caliber team behind Manning.. He's no genius. .

In the process, they set an NFL record with 7 consecutive years with 12 wins or more in the regular season AFTER he led Buffalo on a path to 4 consecutive Superbowl Sundays and got Carolina to an NFC Championship in just their 2nd year of existence. That's one of the best front office resumes I've ever seen.

Polian is a guy who drafts a QB like Jim Kelly and finds a bunch of small school gems like Andre Reed, Don Beebe, Pete Metzlaars, Jeff Wright, Phil Hansen and Mark Kelso and many others. He also picks Peyton Manning over Ryan Leaf while the Cleveland Browns picked Tim Couch over Donovan McNabb, Spergon Wynn over Tom Brady, Scott Milanovich over Kurt Warner, Braylon Edwards over Aaron Rodgers, Kellen Winslow over Ben Roethlisberger. People need to understand the problem we have had to date aren't first round draft picks selecting themselves here - it's been the WRONG front office people in charge of finding the RIGHT players.

The Manning injury didn't help anyone in the franchise. The Kerry Collins idea turned out to be a bad year to bring a guy out of retirement during a lockout year when there were no OTAs or a chance to build preseason chemistry with brand new receivers he's never worked with and a new playbook. Even worse, a lot of Peyton's health disclosure didn't take place until REALLY late from a guy that has always answered the bell. That didn't help the planning process during a lockout year. I would think it's up to the coaching staff to know what backup between Curtis Painter and Dan Orlovsky gave them the best chance to win as early as Collins showed he had no gas left. Clearly, they guessed wrong on Painter.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Flugel

In the process, they set an NFL record with 7 consecutive years with 12 wins or more in the regular season AFTER he led Buffalo on a path to 4 consecutive Superbowl Sundays and got Carolina to an NFC Championship in just their 2nd year of existence. That's one of the best front office resumes I've ever seen.

Polian is a guy who drafts a QB like Jim Kelly and finds a bunch of small school gems like Andre Reed, Don Beebe, Pete Metzlaars, Jeff Wright, Phil Hansen and Mark Kelso and many others. He also picks Peyton Manning over Ryan Leaf while the Cleveland Browns picked Tim Couch over Donovan McNabb, Spergon Wynn over Tom Brady, Scott Milanovich over Kurt Warner, Braylon Edwards over Aaron Rodgers, Kellen Winslow over Ben Roethlisberger. People need to understand the problem we have had to date aren't first round draft picks selecting themselves here - it's been the WRONG front office people in charge of finding the RIGHT players.

The Manning injury didn't help anyone in the franchise. The Kerry Collins idea turned out to be a bad year to bring a guy out of retirement during a lockout year when there were no OTAs or a chance to build preseason chemistry with brand new receivers he's never worked with and a new playbook. Even worse, a lot of Peyton's health disclosure didn't take place until REALLY late from a guy that has always answered the bell. That didn't help the planning process during a lockout year. I would think it's up to the coaching staff to know what backup between Curtis Painter and Dan Orlovsky gave them the best chance to win as early as Collins showed he had no gas left. Clearly, they guessed wrong on Painter.

That's some great, great stuff right there Tom. It truly is. You've clearly cut through the spin and the BS and got to the meat of the matter with the facts. The facts are there is noone better in the NFL when it comes to building a winning franchise from scratch as all three teams show. The facts are Bill Polian is the 2nd best GM in the NFL, 2nd only to Ozzie(I knock Colbert down more than a few pegs, not hard to draft and 'roid up rookies). Bill Polian is UNQUESTIONABLY a MASTER regarding WINNING in the AFC.

The reality is he drafts and he drafts well. Buffalo's success? I'll take it. Indy's? I'd GLADLY take a decade worth of 10-6 being a BAD season and 14-2 being the standard. I'd GLADLY take getting a QB that makes everyone around him better and demands excellence. I'd be ecstatic to have all of that. Apparently others wouldn't. Apparently others would rather try to tear down what is to make our unlovable losers appear better than they are. If I had to boil it all down, though? Bill Polian: 6 Superbowls. Holmgren: 3. Heckert: 1. Neither one is in his league. Both put together can't even match him. Polian is wayyyyy up at the top with the Colbert's, Jimmy Johnson's, Belichicks and Tom Landry's when it comes to building rosters. H&H are down with the Phil Savage's and Matt Millen's of the NFL when it comes to trying to build a roster, FACT. They live off Ron Wolf and Andy Reids hard work, Bill Polians speaks for itself.