First round Wr's since 01

[Solon16]

AGain...these are just facts...draw your own conclusions.

2001
Pick 8 - Chicago Bears - David Terrell Pick 9 - Seattle Seahawks - Koren Robinson
Pick 15 - Washington Redskins - Rod Gardner Pick 16 - New York Jets - Santana Moss
Pick 25 - Philadelphia Eagles - Freddie Mitchell Pick 30 - Indianapolis Colts - Reggie Wayne

2002 Pick 13 - New Orleans Saints - Donte' Stallworth Pick 19 - Denver Broncos - Ashley Lelie
Pick 20 - Green Bay Packers - Javon Walker

03' Pick 2 - Detroit Lions - Charles Rogers Pick 3 - Houston Texans - Andre Johnson
Pick 17 - Arizona Cardinals - Bryant Johnson

04' Pick 3 - Arizona Cardinals - Larry Fitzgerald Pick 7 - Detroit Lions - Roy Williams
Pick 9 - Jacksonville Jaguars - Reggie Williams Pick 13 - Buffalo Bills - Lee Evans
Pick 15 - Tampa Bay Buccaneeers - Michael Clayton Pick 29 - Atlanta Falcons - Michael Jenkins
Pick 31 - San Francisco 49ers - Rashaun Woods

05 Pick 3 - Cleveland Browns - Braylon Edwards Pick 7 - Minnesota Vikings - Troy Williamson
Pick 10 - Detroit Lions - Mike Williams Pick 21 - Jacksonville Jaguars - Matt Jones
Pick 22 - Baltimore Ravens - Mark Clayton Pick 27 - Atlanta Falcons - Roddy White

06 Pick 25 - Pittsburgh Steelers - Santonio Holmes

07 Pick 2 - Detroit Lions - Calvin Johnson Pick 9 - Miami Dolphins - Ted Ginn Jr.
Pick 23 - Kansas City Chiefs - Dwayne Bowe Pick 29 - New Orleans Saints - Robert Meachem
Pick 30 - San Diego Charger - Craig Davis Pick 32 - Indianapolis Colts - Anthony Gonzalez

08' none

09 Pick 7 - Oakland Raiders - Darius Heyward-Bey Pick 10 - San Francisco 49ers - Michael Crabtree
Pick 19 - Philadelphia Eagles - Jeremy Maclin Pick 22 - Minnesota Vikings - Percy Harvin
Pick 29 - NY Giants - Hakeem Nicks Pick 30 - Tennessee Titans - Kenny Britt

10 Pick 22 - Denver Broncos - DeMaryius Thomas Pick 24 - Dallas Cowboys - Dez Bryant
11 pick 4-Aj green Pick 6-Julio Jones Pick 26-Johnathan Baldwin

[Sez.EJ]

WOW... that's even scarier than the QB's.. If that's not a reason to get 2 free agents along with a gamble on Blackmon I dont' know what is.

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by Solon16

09 Pick 7 - Oakland Raiders - Darius Heyward-Bey Pick 10 - San Francisco 49ers - Michael Crabtree
Pick 19 - Philadelphia Eagles - Jeremy Maclin Pick 22 - Minnesota Vikings - Percy Harvin
Pick 29 - NY Giants - Hakeem Nicks Pick 30 - Tennessee Titans - Kenny Britt

10 Pick 22 - Denver Broncos - DeMaryius Thomas Pick 24 - Dallas Cowboys - Dez Bryant
11 pick 4-Aj green Pick 6-Julio Jones Pick 26-Johnathan Baldwin

Thanks for the facts! Looks like the science is getting better since 2009. As everybody knows I never joined the Dez Bryant bandwagon/fanclub; BUT I did want Julio Jones if we went offense/JJ Watt if we went defense. I put my money where my mouth is on 1 of them. The reason we are excited about 2 first round draft picks in 2012 is because of Julio's talent. I also thought we did well in the trade down when our first 2 defensive picks were Phil Taylor and Jabaal Sheard.

The 1st round WRs are alot like the QB position when you think about it. Last year, the only QB that looked the part of franchise QB was Cam Newton. Ponder and Gabbert looked more like beneficiaries of a crappy supply and demand moving 3rd round QBs into round 1. That's when the best player available thing trumps need. I'm willing to be controversial and say I think Case Keenum can be a very nice draft pick somewhere in the vicinity of where Aaron Rodgers went in round 1 in comparison to the more gotta have Alex Smith in all the consensus mock drafts. 7 Offensive Coordinators later we realize the person that did his research for a Green Bay team drafting where playoff teams draft in round 1 was brilliant even if they already had Favre. If Keenum gets the recycled Drew Brees pre draft scouting report - he can be found in round 2 and that wouldn't suck.

Tell you what though - I'm willing to change my take on the Big 12 QB if you can find me one former Big 12 QB that was WINNING more often than Charlie Sheen was last year.

Defensive end USED to have a lot of busts in round 1 and position with such a high demand and may continue that way. The good news is that educated consumers found guys like JJ Watt and Aldon Smith. When Super Mario went down, the Houston D played a large percentage of snaps with 4 guys with a hand down up front. Ironically, the JJ Watt who wasn't supposed to be suited for a 4 man front played his best football in that front. Who knew?

In the end, you HAVE to do your research. If it's thorough and RGIII is the guy - we'll ALL end up celebrating "happily ever after." I just find it amusing that people never learned from Akili Smith and Jamarcus Russell flying up the mock draft consenses all over cyberspace at the last minute. I've been getting lectures from people that have seen parts of 2 or 3 games RGIII played in the last 4 years. Don't worry Solon, I know you live Texas so you'll be telling us you had season tix to games in WACO ever since Moby Dick was a minnow. I was glad to hear you were announcing his arrival for the last 2-3 years even if it had to conveniently take place on another message board after I reminded you how wonderful the powers of archive are here.

[Solon16]

Don't worry Solon, I know you live Texas so you'll be telling us you had season tix to games in WACO ever since Moby Dick was a minnow. I was glad to hear you were announcing his arrival for the last 2 years even if it had to conveniently take place on another message board after I reminded you how wonderful the powers of archive are here.


Thanks for this inciteful input on 1st round wr's...your welcome for the research. Choose to believe what you want...I have mentioned Robert griffin since he was a freshman...I don't have season tickets but I have seen him play in person twice and unfortunately I have to watch big 12 football on Saturdays so I have seen him more than anyone else on this board...I'd rather watch the Big 10 play since I spent 35 years in Cleveland before I moved here...P.S. It'll be 77 today and 83 tomorrow!

[Tobalaz]

1st round qbs since 01
2001
#1 - Mike Vick - Atlanta Falcons

2002
#1 - David Carr - Houston Texans
#3 - Joey Harrington - Detroit Lions
#32 - Patrick Ramsey - Washington Redskins

2003
#1 - Carson Palmer - Cincinnati
#7 - Byron Leftwich - Jacksonville
#19 - Kyle Boller - Baltimore
#22 - Rex Grossman - Chicago

2004
#1 - Eli Manning - San Diego (traded to NY)
#4 - Philip Rivers - NY (traded to San Diego)
#11 - Ben Roethlisberger - Pittsburgh
#22 - JP Losman - Buffalo

2005
#1 - Alex Smith - San Francisco
#24 - Aaron Rodgers - Green Bay
#25 - Jason Campbell - Washington

2006
#3 - Vince Young - Tennessee
#10 - Matt Leinart - Arizona
#11 - Jay Cutler - Denver

2007
#1 - JaMarcus Russell - Oakland
#22 - Brady Quinn - Cleveland

2008
#3 - Matt Ryan - Atlanta
#18 - Joe Flacco - Baltimore

2009
#1 - Matthew Stafford - Detroit
#5 - Mark Sanchez - NYJ
#17 - Josh Freeman - Tampa

2010
#1 - Sam Bradford
#25 - Tim Tebow

2011
#1 - Cam Newton - Carolina
#8 - Jake Locker - Tennessee
#10 - Blaine Gabbert - Jacksonville
#12 - Christian Ponder - Minnesota

These are just the facts, draw your own conclusions....

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

Yah it's true, as I stated in another thread that since our return in '99 ...70% of all WRs taken in the top 10 have been total busts.

70%.

But that doesn't fit in the illogical arguments of those who want to draft a WR in the top 5 who doesn't even belong in the top 5 to begin with, a WR some "experts" are saying isn't even the best in this class.

If we don't go the logical route, and grab a potential franchise QB when we have a rare opportunity to do so ....here's to hoping we trade down so we can surround our future star QB Thad Lewis with more talent.

Since when did asking for your football team to grab the BPA (which would be RG3 at 2 let alone 4) and posting your opinion on a forum become a lecture? Since when did fans calling on their football team to take the opportunity while it is there, and to get your signal caller so they can stop relying on a below average, under skilled 3rd round QB from the same "gimmick" offenses you are so quick to throw RG3 under the bus for become "uninformed", "panicked" "haters", who are "desperate" and don't do their research?

All I would say is look in the mirror. The illogical & undaunted support of our 3rd round farm boy, all because he looked decent for a few games in a different system with different coaches 2 years ago when there was no book on him is mind boggling.

I was front and center in not only my support of Colt, but was I think one of 2 guys hoping we could land him in the draft. I liked 2 QBs from that entire draft, McCoy & Tebow. I was wrong about McCoy ...we are where we are, we are running the system we are, and we have the coaches we have ....sorry to say but McCoy just can't do it. We need a QB who can and we will get no better than average until we have him. This year we have a top 5 pick and an opportunity at a very exciting young prospect. Common sense suggests .....

QB 1a. WR 1b.

Prediction: With McCoy under center, we will have at most 6 wins next season.
With RG3 under center in his rookie year, in a new offense and as a new professional, we will have at least 6 wins.

Again, we'll see how it plays out. And if we don't draft an elite prospect @ QB ...I hope we do get to see some more of Thad Lewis next season, I've heard great things about the kid ...maybe he's the next Tom Brady and we can all hang our hats on that for the next 3 years.

[golfer704u]

Originally Posted by TheBestPlayersPlay

.

Prediction: With McCoy under center, we will have at most 6 wins next season.
With RG3 under center in his rookie year, in a new offense and as a new professional, we will have at least 6 wins.

Again, I'll be rooting for RGIII if we draft him. But I'll remember this prediction and won't accept any excuses about who the OC is, who the WRs are, who the oline is, how many drops there are, who the RB is.

All those things are questions RIGHT NOW, so just like another certain poster who didn't like me reminding them of proclamations they made about Shurmur. I'll be doing the same for folks sure adding a rookie QB will make us IMEDIATELY better.

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

You seem to post that as a threat or something but I can assure I lose no sleep over making predictions so feel free to hold my feet to the fire. You're leaning RG3 as well aren't you?

And whether he makes us immediately better or not is not a concern of mine, again simply a prediction.

If Shurmur runs another season into the ground whether it's Colt or someone else, he would likely be gone. Although I was listening to a guy from Seattle the other day who knows Holmgren very well, and he was saying he is a verrrrrry slow, patient man. (to a fault) You guys should love him! (I kid) That being said, maybe we will still be stuck with Shurms & Co. even if season #2 is another abortion.

OT but what really has me negged out right now is some of the guys being looked into as head coaches this season. Guys like Chud & Tressell, both coaches I love. Had Mangini failed to get us to 8-8 in season 3, those would be the guys we'd be looking at. *sigh*

[golfer704u]

Originally Posted by TheBestPlayersPlay

You seem to post that as a threat or something but I can assure I lose no sleep over making predictions so feel free to hold my feet to the fire. You're leaning RG3 as well aren't you?

And whether he makes us immediately better or not is not a concern of mine, again simply a prediction.

If Shurmur runs another season into the ground whether it's Colt or someone else, he would likely be gone. Although I was listening to a guy from Seattle the other day who knows Holmgren very well, and he was saying he is a verrrrrry slow, patient man. (to a fault) You guys should love him! (I kid) That being said, maybe we will still be stuck with Shurms & Co. even if season #2 is another abortion.

OT but what really has me negged out right now is some of the guys being looked into as head coaches this season. Guys like Chud & Tressell, both coaches I love. Had Mangini failed to get us to 8-8 in season 3, those would be the guys we'd be looking at. *sigh*

Two things not a threat, just a reminder that I don't forget things. I am leaning towards RGIII, but I believe it will mean LESS wins next season than if we stayed with McCoy. The question is, who's ceiling is higher and who's better in the long run. And that MIGHT be RGIII.

As for Holmgren, he's only patient with HIS guys. you know, the guys that suck up to him and call him coach and worship at his alter of a resume.

AND, I'll make you THIS prediction. IF they draft RGIII, THAT WILL BE THE EXACT REASON that Shumur is given another year even if they suck again next year.

Holmgren : "you people just don't understand, you're either with me or against me. I have every faith in pat Shurmur because I hired him and I can't be wrong. We just drafted a rookie QB, it takes a QB 3 years to develop in this league so Shurmur will be my coach for those 3 years which will make 5 total for him before I retire into the sunset and let you Clevelan people cry when I am gone."

[TheBestPlayersPlay]

Originally Posted by golfer704u

AND, I'll make you THIS prediction. IF they draft RGIII, THAT WILL BE THE EXACT REASON that Shumur is given another year even if they suck again next year.

LOL I kind of had the same thought. That being said, it won't be the reason rather it will be the excuse. If RG3 isn't drafted, he'll find another one.

[Solon16]

Ummm...thanks again for all your inciteful Wr dialog...appreciated

[Flugel]

Originally Posted by TheBestPlayersPlay

Yah it's true, as I stated in another thread that since our return in '99 ...70% of all WRs taken in the top 10 have been total busts.

70%.

Even worse, 100% of Big 12 QBs have been total busts. 100%

Are you insinuating a division with 3 playoff teams in it is easier than facing those Big 12 defenses? That would be sweet if true. The ONLY team Dalton beat in our division was the one QBed by a Big 12 grad; and he needed Gradkowski plus our our cooperation to remain in the huddle while they no-huddled us to an uncontest TD pass to AJ Green. Who would you rather swap - Dalton for McCoy or AJ Green for Greg Little?

Meanwhile, the Browns have drafted the following WRs after round 1 since 1999:
Kevin Johnson
Darrin Chiaverinni (might have been an undrafted FA - didn't have time to confirm)
Dennis Northcutt
Quincy Morgan
Andre Davis
Travis Wilson
Paul Hubbard
Brian Robiskie
Mohamed Massaquoi
Brian Robiske
Carlton Mitchell
Greg Little

The 1 season (and I know it was only 1) Braylon Edwards prioritized football in his life - he scored 16 or 17 TDs, we won 10 games and he made the Pro Bowl. Did we ever get closer than that 1 year for an acceptable playmaker in the passing game? It put a QB like Derek Anderson in the Pro Bowl so don't tell me a playmaker couldn't help McCoy better than the ones here leading the NFL in dropped passes. I've seen first hand what play makers can do for BACKUP QBs. A totally inexperienced Matt Cassell won 10 Games in Brady's absence 1 year when it was Moss deep and Welker cashing in on underneathe with NO Safeties in the box. Matt Flynn threw for almost 500 yards and 5 TDs in 1 start.

I guess a Big 12 QB doesn't need playmakers just ask Sam Bradford. St Louis has 2 DEs from upper round 1, and 1 terrific RB to go with their #1 overall pick at QB. They also used your idea and drafted 3 or 4 WRs after round 1 last year. Why did they need a new Head Coach? Why are they drafting ahead of us? What's the problem? They did everything you want us to do right down to the Heisman Trophy winning hero.

Gabe, we'll all root for RGIII if he's the guy they choose. Having said that, don't let me hear 1 terrible twos session about bad playcalling, no time to throw or the young QB just needs playmakers. If we LACK playmakers, we're still not going to see YAC. Running short slants into heavy traffic toward ILBers is a big reason our WRs take their eyes off the football and drop it.

We once traded a first round WR named Paul Warfield to the Miami Dolphins so we could grab a QB at #3 overall. Paul Warfield would go on to be the SPEEDY reason Safeties couldn't cheat into the box to stop Csonka, Morris and Kick from rushing for almost 3000 yards in just 14 regular season games at the time. Meanwhile, guess what the excuse was for Mike Phipps? He just needs play makers, better blocking and a new OC/HC. It's about 40 years later and we're right back to almost the exact same scenario.