Childress fired from Vikings

[hiwaygal]

This is where we start to disagree KoK...

With the other 'ism' fully in play within the NFL (nepotism), the Rooney Rule is needed.

Not to turn this into a political debate, there was a time and place for affirmative action too. And in some cases/specific jobs where there is still a need for it.

Racism exists, whether we like it or not. As long as it does and people don't get equal opportunities, then the Rooney Rule will still have a place.

I don't like the implications that affirmative action/EEO/the Rooney Rule have (favoritism is shown to one group above others). But I don't know how else to ensure there really are equal opportunities.

[DaBrowns41]

Originally Posted by hiwaygal

This is where we start to disagree KoK...

With the other 'ism' fully in play within the NFL (nepotism), the Rooney Rule is needed.

Not to turn this into a political debate, there was a time and place for affirmative action too. And in some cases/specific jobs where there is still a need for it.

Racism exists, whether we like it or not. As long as it does and people don't get equal opportunities, then the Rooney Rule will still have a place.

I don't like the implications that affirmative action/EEO/the Rooney Rule have (favoritism is shown to one group above others). But I don't know how else to ensure there really are equal opportunities.

I don't mind the rule, and while I think it's dumb that it has to be enforced, I understand to an extent.

What I DO think is stupid is that even after a team has decided that they really want to hire a coach and make an offer, they still have to interview an african american. That's just a waste of time, IMO. If you know the guy that you want to hire, why do you have to use some of what little time you have, to bring him in for a formal interview?

That's my only beef. I remember that being an issue either this past off-season, or the prior off-season, and teams getting a bit frustrated with it.

But while racism exists, I don't think people are sitting there saying "nope... that guys black. I don't care what his offensive philosophy is, I'm not hiring him". The same thing goes with the Jamele Hill article about racism with quarterbacks.

There's a fine line in determining what can be considered racism, and what can be considered fair.

[Vegasdogg]

Originally Posted by DaBrowns41

What I DO think is stupid is that even after a team has decided that they really want to hire a coach and make an offer, they still have to interview an african american. That's just a waste of time, IMO. If you know the guy that you want to hire, why do you have to use some of what little time you have, to bring him in for a formal interview?

But that is not the spirit of the Rooney Rule. It was for these black coaches who have a fairly large population among assistants and coordinators throughout the league/NCAA, to gain experience and knowledge from the interview process. It is not a waste of time in that sense, and while the team hiring whomever they wish and not needing to hear from this guy, the Rooney Rule ensures this candidate gets an interview on record, his name possibly gets passed around for future HC positions, and he knows the questions and formats for the interview process.

Lots of white candidates were getting this opportunity even though they were not the ideal choice at the time for that team, but blacks didn't get that opportunity. The Rooney Rule looks to rectify the gap in white and black candidates getting interview experience.

[Vegasdogg]

KOK you have a problem with Dungy that seems to go way beyond the normal dislike of a coach. Dungy called out Ben and Romo for leaderships issues so he is racist? Everyone called those two out.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Vegasdogg

KOK you have a problem with Dungy that seems to go way beyond the normal dislike of a coach.

I have a problem with all racists, he happens to be the topic we are discussing.

[Vegasdogg]

Originally Posted by King of Kings

I have a problem with all racists, he happens to be the topic we are discussing.

Dude really now. Tony Dungy is a racist? Really? You mention two QB's (Romo, Ben) who are white that he criticized, and one (Vick) who is black that he counseled, but fail to mention his comments about Vince Young and McNabb, and this is supposed to demonstate that he favors blacks over whites? And he liked for HC the following: Caldwell, Smith, Lewis, Tomlin and Frazier. Hard to disagree with that since they're all pretty good NFL coaches. (Lewis catches a break from me because "white" Mike Brown is the GM.)

Hyperbole is back again on this board?

I find it hard to believe that a leader in the black community like Tony Dungy needs to pimp white coaches. Does he need to start pimping guys like Jason Garrett and Josh McDaniels or something?

Big reach here IMO. Dungy doesn't need to be labeled a racist for pointing out the development of black coaches in the NFL. White coaches don't need a white Dungy, if you haven't noticed.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Vegasdogg

Dude really now. Tony Dungy is a racist? Really? You mention two QB's (Romo, Ben) who are white that he criticized, and one (Vick) who is black that he counseled,

I've mentioned alot more than that.

As to the QB's, since we're deflecting the argument to there it was more to the point while Tony D is giving Vicks herpes covered johnson a handjob and trying to convince NFL GM's that piece of shit needed to be a starting NFL QB he starts throwing multiple QB's under the bus. Funny, they happen to be white ones. It was also to illustrate two other issues, first being if you're ghetto trash doing time in prison for slaughtering innocent dogs and infecting innocent females with STD's you're a fine leader. If you're some backwoods whiteboy apparently you need benched.

Secondly it's the fact Dungy is willing to visit said piece of shit in prison and mentor him back into the NFL, yet it's pure condemnation of Big Ben. Hey, he wants to pull the Christian bullshit and prop himself up as a mentor to Athletes where was Bens mentorship? Where was that forgiveness he was oh so willing to lavish apon his homie? Heh, I guess it's just coincidence, that or pinning a dog on the ground and ramming a stun gun into it's neck electrocuting it to death is a less serious crime than being falsely accused of crimes.

I notice you keep skipping over that part where he whined on TV that he didn't like his sons seeing interracial relationships, being taught that it's okay to date whites. It's funny, had it been Cowher or Gruden stating they didn't like NFL commercials teaching their daughters it's okay to date blacks they would be blackballed from the NFL and issuing weekly apologies for the next several years. Probably a 2 hour ESPN special documenting their recovery as well.

Originally Posted by Vegasdogg

I find it hard to believe that a leader in the black community like Tony Dungy needs to pimp white coaches. Does he need to start pimping guys like Jason Garrett and Josh McDaniels or something?

You're missing the point dude, race shouldn't even be a factor. See unlike Dungy(among others) i'm not calling for a quota here. All I ask is endorse the best coach for the job, irregardless of race. I will once again throw out the reversal: You would be fully agreeing with me if it were a Cowher or Jimmy Johnson going out of their way to only hype up white coaching candidates(while simultaneously throwing multiple black coaches under the bus).

But hey, why should someone with a platform throw out endorsements and niceties towards whiteys? Afterall you just said it all, he's leading the BLACK Community(Whatever happened to just THE community?). Fuck Ron Rivera, Brian Schottenheimer, Russ Grimm, Mike Shanahan or anyone else. Wait did I just say Russ Grimm? Ahh yes, the guy the Steelers gave the vacant HC job to and leaked to the local media only to rescind the offer and hire the guy Dungy spent a year hyping the ever living shit out of. Who was it who called Dan Rooney up again, sticking his nose in another persons business pressuring them to hire Tomlin? Ahh yeah, Dungy. But hey, why should he congratulate Grimm on landing the job and wish him the best? He's a white candidate.

Care to address his track record?

Washington Redskins show heavy interest in Mike Shanahan, ultimately choosing him for their Head Coach vacancy. Complied with Rooney Rule yet called racist by Dungy for choosing an experienced, Superbowl winning coach over inexperienced, unproven DB Coach Jerry Gray.

Seattle Seahawks approach Dungy for GM/HC opening with sincerity. Dungy declines offer. Seahawks comply with Rooney Rule before choosing experienced head coach Pete Carroll. Dungy pulls race card because they too went with a proven, experienced head coach over inexperienced DC Leslie Frazier.

Dallas Cowboys interview Mike Singletary for vacancy left by Bill Parcells. Cowboys ultimately choose Wade Phillips. Dungy proceeds to throw Phillips under the bus every chance he gets.

Pittsburgh Steelers ownership offers vacant head coaching job to Russ Grimm after a lengthy search. Dungy reportedly calls them to reconsider and hire Mike Tomlin instead. (How was it any of his goddamn business in the first place?)

Boasts on Sunday Night Football during the preseason he would NEVER hire Rex Ryan(who took his team to the AFC Championships in his first season) for a head coaching job. Continues to take digs every chance he gets.

Threw Chargers HC Norv Turner under the bus early in the season(more on that in a moment).

Jay Cutler gets buried by Dungy.

Big Ben gets buried by Dungy.

Tony Romo gets buried by Dungy....

Undermines Kevin Kolb every week that he started....

But yes, there's more!

If you're Rex Ryan and you bring in character risks? Dungy has a problem with it.

If you're Marvin Lewis and you bring in nothing but character risks? You're praised by Dungy for giving players a 2nd chance.

If you hang out with a scumbag like Vick you're being a "good christian."

If you're Rex Ryan and you fail to bench Braylon Edwards over a DUI, Tony Dungy calls you out for it on national TV.

If you're Jim Caldwell and you refrain from benching Fili Moala after getting a DUI, Tony Dungy remains silent.

If you're Rex Ryan and you curse alot during practices Dungy calls you out and complains multiple times on national tv.

If you're Mike Tomlin, Lovie Smith or Marvin Lewis and cuss just as much as Rex Ryan during practices? Well apparently that's okay.

If you're Norv Turner and your team has a bad game, expect Tony Dungy to pin every mistake on your shoulders on national TV.

If you're Marvin Lewis or Lovie Smith and you go into a game unprepared resulting in a beatdown, well that's all the players faults and they need to step it up.

If you're Jay Cutler and after your new HC attempted to trade for multiple quarterbacks 5 minutes after being named coach you demand a trade you lack maturity and leadership ability. You are a huge risk and shouldn't have been traded for.

If you're Michael Vick and you go to prison for murdering innocent dogs, running an organized crime ring and infecting women with STD's, you made an honest mistake but deserve to be a starting QB again.

If you're Tony Romo and you bust your ass trying to make plays despite getting destroyed because of a bad O.L. you lack leadership ability and the traits of a franchise QB.

If you're Michael Vick and you go to prison for murdering innocent dogs, running an organized crime ring and infecting women with STD's, you possess all of the required leadership ability of a franchise QB and deserve to start at QB.

If you're Big Ben and you've been falsely accused of rape in two bogus lawsuits you should be suspended by the NFL and benched for Dennis Dixon.

If you're Michael Vick and you go to prison for murdering innocent dogs, running an organized crime ring and infecting women with STD's, you should be immediately reinstated into the NFL and handed a job starting at quarterback.

If you're Big Ben and you serve your NFL Mandated suspension, attend required therapy classes and stay out of trouble you should sit the rest of the season, Dennis Dixon, Charlie Batch or Byron Leftwich should be the starting QB of the Steelers.

If you're Michael Vick and you go to prison for murdering innocent dogs, running an organized crime ring and infecting women with STD's, you served your time during your brief stint in a country club "prison" and should be named starter by an NFL team.

If you're Donovan McNabb and you're benched for the backup QB in a game, you should rightfully be pissed off.

If you're Kevin Kolb and you're benched for a dog killing piece of shit who shouldn't even be in the NFL, well Mike Vick is entitled to start and you should take your lumps and work harder.

If you're Tony Romo and you throw 5 int's while running for your life after taking 6 sacks earlier in the game you're just not a good QB.

If you're Jason Campbell and you were called out for being a bad QB by Rodney Harrison it isn't you're fault, it's an organizational issue and lack of supporting cast. You're a "great leader" and a "stable quarterback." Big Ben nor Romo are, but Jason Campbell is!

Big Ben takes the Steelers to multiple Superbowls, Tony Romo has the Cowboys in the playoffs multiple times, but they're not good QB's or leaders. However.....

In Dungy's book Tarvaris Jackson is a playoff caliber QB and worth starting.

If you're Mike Vick? Dungy will work day and night to get you back in the NFL.
Larry Johnson and just cut from a team for being a dumbass? Father Dungy will reach out to you and get the Bengals to give you a job.
Over the hill WR out of the NFL after an altercation involving a weapon? Father Tony will lobby for you to be signed somewhere.
Are you a College Coach(Mike Locksley) who assaulted an assistant coach? Dungy will mentor you.

However...

Are you a QB sued over bogus crimes? You should be suspended. You don't deserve a talk or guidance.
A white NFL head coach who assaulted an assistant?
Are you Matt Jones? Do you want a 2nd chance in the NFL? Are you busting your ass to get another shake, hoping someone will help you out after addressing your substance abuse issues? Well, Father Dungy isn't even going to offer his guidance or help. Sorry Matt.


That's hyperbole? Look it all up, it's shit straight from Dungy's mouth. Those are only a few instances. Please, let's call a spade a spade. The guy isn't hyping the shit out of black coaches, quarterbacks and candidates while throwing their white counterparts under the bus for no reason. He isn't exclusively pimping black coaching candidates for no reason. He isn't complaining and whining about the NCAA and pulling the race card for no reason.

So what exactly do we call the guy, then? His actions speak volumes. I just spent 20 minutes digging up multiple examples, hopefully they like my previous posts aren't dismissed because you choose not to look at reality or worse, condone it(I wonder. Sorry man, some of your comments are coming off that way). So a coach who almost exclusively hires those of the same race as he, only promotes those of his race for jobs, wants his kids to "stick with their own kind", has a different set of standards for people based on their race and throws those that are't his race under the bus ISN'T racist? C'mon man.

[Vegasdogg]

You have serious issues man, because that is some disturbing shit. No proof, just baseless accusations you made up in your head. You're sick man. Post some articles to back up these claims, because without any sources you are just throwing around lies.

[King of Kings]

Originally Posted by Vegasdogg

You have serious issues man, because that is some disturbing shit. No proof, just baseless accusations you made up in your head. You're sick man. Post some articles to back up these claims, because without any sources you are just throwing around lies.

So you insult me, then want me to do your homework for you? Ha, fuck off. I didn't make any of it up. You want proof? Go hit Google retard, it's all readily available. But we all know you won't go research it, you'll just continue to throw out more insults and bullshit. What's a matter, upset a brutha is being exposed as a piece of shit? Keep fightin' the powah, homie.

[Vegasdogg]

You made the accusations so the burden of proof is not on me. I call bullshit on most of your comments because you cannot back up any of them with sources.

You are the lazy one kok. I don't need to research your silly conclusions because they're not factual. Bring some facts and stop being lazy.

You won't because you can't.