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Thread: patriots balls underinflated

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    Default patriots balls underinflated

    11 of 12 were. Who thinks they should be banned from super bowl? I don't think colts really deserve to get in....so let green bay and Seattle have rematch. And ban patriots for 3 years from postseason play.

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    The NFL won't do that. However, I think they should lose two full years of draft picks.

    Hopefully the Seahawks deflate their balls. All over the Patriots' faces.
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    This is such a non-issue it is unbelievable. I think it is a cheap and dirty tactic to pull off right before the Super Bowl. I guess it no big deal that Aaron Rodgers publicly stated that he likes his footballs over-inflated so he can get a better grip on the ball. So I guess the door only swings one way as long as the Pats are on the other side of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo View Post
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    This is such a non-issue it is unbelievable. I think it is a cheap and dirty tactic to pull off right before the Super Bowl. I guess it no big deal that Aaron Rodgers publicly stated that he likes his footballs over-inflated so he can get a better grip on the ball. So I guess the door only swings one way as long as the Pats are on the other side of it.
    Difference is, Rodgers they over inflate BEFORE they are tested...and if the refs deflate them...then that is it. That is not cheating, it is seeing if it will be accepted.

    Apparently the Pats deflated the balls AFTER they were tested. THAT is cheating, as it is circumventing the test.

    Plus, there is a history.

    Still not sure why nobody is connecting the dots on the sudden disruptive behavior that got Blount kicked out of Pittsburgh...the very same week the Patriots lost their last RB (except for a practice squad kid)....add in the fact Blount played in NE last year and I can't imagine the amount of 'coincidence' necessary to explain that off as NOT being a potential tampering case.

    Sorry, but the rule is the rule, it is very obvious there was an attempt to circumvent, and there is a history. They should lose at least their first round pick and hefty fine for both the coach and the owner.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    Difference is, Rodgers they over inflate BEFORE they are tested...and if the refs deflate them...then that is it. That is not cheating, it is seeing if it will be accepted.

    Apparently the Pats deflated the balls AFTER they were tested. THAT is cheating, as it is circumventing the test.

    Plus, there is a history.

    Still not sure why nobody is connecting the dots on the sudden disruptive behavior that got Blount kicked out of Pittsburgh...the very same week the Patriots lost their last RB (except for a practice squad kid)....add in the fact Blount played in NE last year and I can't imagine the amount of 'coincidence' necessary to explain that off as NOT being a potential tampering case.

    Sorry, but the rule is the rule, it is very obvious there was an attempt to circumvent, and there is a history. They should lose at least their first round pick and hefty fine for both the coach and the owner.
    So I guess today's lesson is you can cheat, just don't get caught doing it. Nobody seems to care that the Steelers of the 70's were roided up when they won all those Super Bowls. The NFL is a joke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo View Post
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    This is such a non-issue it is unbelievable. I think it is a cheap and dirty tactic to pull off right before the Super Bowl. I guess it no big deal that Aaron Rodgers publicly stated that he likes his footballs over-inflated so he can get a better grip on the ball. So I guess the door only swings one way as long as the Pats are on the other side of it.
    FYI....this is not something 'pulled off' right before the Super Bowl....apparently the NFL has had this reported before:

    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...with-patriots/

    However, a published report Wednesday says the Colts’ suspicions about the inflation of New England’s footballs date back at least to the regular season matchup with New England on November 16.
    And again, an interception — two of them, actually — was the catalyst.
    According to ESPN’s Adam Schefter, the Colts notified the NFL about potential under-inflation after safety Mike Adams picked off Brady twice in New England’s 42-20 victory.
    In both cases, ESPN reported, Adams took the ball to the sideline as a memento, then gave it to the team’s equipment staff.
    It was then, ESPN said, that the inflation of the footballs came into question.
    Poor little Patriots...everyone always expecting them to play by the rules...it just isn't fair!!!
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    Should be docked a pick at least. Prolly a 3rd rounder.

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    How come the refs spotting the ball for the Patriots the entire game didn't notice it until it was pointed out by a player? Aaron Rodgers stated he likes his footballs inflated more because he has big hands, does anyone check Green Bay's footballs? Why are they allowed to scuff up the footballs? If the ball is slick, make them adjust to it and learn how to throw it. Why are receivers allowed to wear gloves? Did any of the Patriot players know the footballs were deflated?

    Judging by the final score, I doubt the deflated footballs had that big of an impact on the game. In a league where Mike Tomlin openly cheats in front of the entire nation by jumping in a players way, they sure didn't make that big of a deal about it. But someone deflating a football, OH NOOO

    As a Browns fan, I would not be upset if it was against our team. This is a non-issue and would be upset if they Pats were severely punished. This league has gone to shit.

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    I think if Andrew Luck, the Colts center or the officials didn't immediately report it from the moment they touched the football then it's a complete non-issue. If none of them noticed a difference, it seems a little odd that the Pats are being attacked so strongly for something treated as 'cheating'

    Also worth a mention, this was apparently corrected at half time and the Patriots were better in the second half than they were the first. So a correctly inflated ball seems more advantageous. I have little doubt Brady can throw the fuck out of any football.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    Quote: However, a published report Wednesday says the Colts’ suspicions about the inflation of New England’s footballs date back at least to the regular season matchup with New England on November 16. And again, an interception — two of them, actually — was the catalyst. According to ESPN’s Adam Schefter, the Colts notified the NFL about potential under-inflation after safety Mike Adams picked off Brady twice in New England’s 42-20 victory. In both cases, ESPN reported, Adams took the ball to the sideline as a memento, then gave it to the team’s equipment staff. It was then, ESPN said, that the inflation of the footballs came into question.
    Well now, maybe the Colts had something to do with this considering they accused them before of the same thing. Why has no other team come forward about this??? Strange.

    Quote Originally Posted by brownsdownunder View Post
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    I think if Andrew Luck, the Colts center
    Colts use their own footballs. I still find it hard to believe the officials didn't know about it considering they touch the ball after every play.
    Last edited by Neo; 01-22-2015 at 12:54 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by brownsdownunder View Post
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    I think if Andrew Luck, the Colts center or the officials didn't immediately report it from the moment they touched the football then it's a complete non-issue. If none of them noticed a difference, it seems a little odd that the Pats are being attacked so strongly for something treated as 'cheating'
    Each offense uses their own balls. Luck and the Colts center would never touch one of the Balls the Patriots brought to the game.

    Quote Originally Posted by brownsdownunder View Post
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    Also worth a mention, this was apparently corrected at half time and the Patriots were better in the second half than they were the first. So a correctly inflated ball seems more advantageous. I have little doubt Brady can throw the fuck out of any football.
    No, it was not corrected at halftime. A single ball was taken to the league at halftime. The balls were not re-inflated.

    Quote Originally Posted by neo View Post
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    Well now, maybe the Colts had something to do with this considering they accused them before of the same thing. Why has no other team come forward about this??? Strange.
    Actually it just came out that the Ravens tipped them off that they Patriots may have been doing something with the balls.

    Quote Originally Posted by neo View Post
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    Aaron Rodgers stated he likes his footballs inflated more because he has big hands, does anyone check Green Bay's footballs? Why are they allowed to scuff up the footballs? If the ball is slick, make them adjust to it and learn how to throw it. Why are receivers allowed to wear gloves? Did any of the Patriot players know the footballs were deflated?
    As long as the scuffing and over-inflation occurs BEFORE the ball is inspected, it is legal. It is the fact that the Pats did it AFTER the inspection that causes the issue.

    Now, on to why it matters.

    Do you really think someone is going to go to the measure of removing 2lbs of psi AFTER the officials checked the balls if it didn't matter in a significant way? I mean, playing cards, if you were going to cheat would you hide a 2 or 3 up your sleave, or an ACE??? It just doesn't make sense to do that if it isn't significant.

    Now the full conspiracy theory (I love these): Through week 4 of the 2014 NFL season, Tom Brady was looking pretty average. He had no more than 1 TD in any game, had not had more than 249 yards, and had 2 of the four games with a QBR below 70. After week 4 he had ZERO games with less than 2 TD's, ZERO games with less than 245 yards, and ZERO games with a QBR less than 85.

    Now, the media attributed it to him being a competitor...but every player is a competitor. And how many times does that dramatic of a change occur without something tangible driving it. My guess is that with age Tom Terrific's grip is not what it used to be. A lower PSI ball would allow him the added grip and control necessary to play his style of QB. Chances are, and my theory, is that between week 4 and week 5 the Pats staff and Brady got together and discovered by lowering the PSI by about 2lbs gave him the ability to grip and throw the ball accurately. See the comments by Mark Brunell about the grip:

    Former NFL quarterback and three-time Pro Bowler Mark Brunell, now with ESPN as an NFL analyst, said in a phone conversation Wednesday that the deflated balls reportedly used by the Patriots during their 45-7 win over the Indianapolis Colts in the AFC championship game could make "a remarkable difference" in a quarterback's grip and performance.
    Reportedly, 11 of the 12 balls used by the Patriots during the game were inflated two pounds per square inch below the league's requirements.
    "The main thing was the difference that two psi (pounds per square inch) can make," said Brunell, who got a chance to inspect a ball that fit that description earlier Wednesday on SportsCenter. "It's a remarkable difference because you're able to grip it a lot easier. The ball we used on SportsCenter, it felt like a ball you could get out of your garage and go play ball with with your son. There's just a big difference."
    I highly doubt this ball tampering is only over the past two playoff games...or even started on 11/16 with the first game against the Colts. This was likely an organizational (and by that, I mean Belichick was involved) to assist Brady. And of course, Brady knew (and that it was illegal)....and likely their Center and all their WR's definitely were aware of the 'lighter' ball...they may not, however, have known the illegality of it.

    Again, you don't cheat if it doesn't give you an advantage. It just doesn't make sense.
    Last edited by DawgFan; 01-22-2015 at 10:11 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    As long as the scuffing and over-inflation occurs BEFORE the ball is inspected, it is legal. It is the fact that the Pats did it AFTER the inspection that causes the issue. Now, on to why it matters. Do you really think someone is going to go to the measure of removing 2lbs of psi AFTER the officials checked the balls if it didn't matter in a significant way? I mean, playing cards, if you were going to cheat would you hide a 2 or 3 up your sleave, or an ACE??? It just doesn't make sense to do that if it isn't significant. Now the full conspiracy theory (I love these): Through week 4 of the 2014 NFL season, Tom Brady was looking pretty average. He had no more than 1 TD in any game, had not had more than 249 yards, and had 2 of the four games with a QBR below 70. After week 4 he had ZERO games with less than 2 TD's, ZERO games with less than 245 yards, and ZERO games with a QBR less than 85. Now, the media attributed it to him being a competitor...but every player is a competitor. And how many times does that dramatic of a change occur without something tangible driving it. My guess is that with age Tom Terrific's grip is not what it used to be. A lower PSI ball would allow him the added grip and control necessary to play his style of QB. Chances are, and my theory, is that between week 4 and week 5 the Pats staff and Brady got together and discovered by lowering the PSI by about 2lbs gave him the ability to grip and throw the ball accurately. See the comments by Mark Brunell about the grip:
    In regards to the scuffing, why let them do it at all? It is altering the ball.

    I know in this country you are guilty until proven innocent, but can anybody PROVE that a player, or a member of the Patriots staff tampered with the footballs? If not, then this is a non issue like I have been stating. You can't convict, or punish someone without any actual evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo View Post
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    In regards to the scuffing, why let them do it at all? It is altering the ball.

    I know in this country you are guilty until proven innocent, but can anybody PROVE that a player, or a member of the Patriots staff tampered with the footballs? If not, then this is a non issue like I have been stating. You can't convict, or punish someone without any actual evidence.
    The balls were tested by the officials and were of proper psi, then they were given to the Pats...then they were tested again and they were low psi. Not sure how anyone else did it...and when none of the opposting teams balls failed...hmmm.

    As for the scuffing, I agree, don't let them do it. But balls are used in multiple games so they will naturally get scuffed. Unless they mandate new balls for every game, not sure how that would work.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    Each offense uses their own balls. Luck and the Colts center would never touch one of the Balls the Patriots brought to the game.


    No, it was not corrected at halftime. A single ball was taken to the league at halftime. The balls were not re-inflated.
    Wow, I didn't know teams had their own balls to use. I thought it was just whatever ball you got. In that case, I say let teams use whatever they want. Rodgers likes em' hard, Brady likes em' soft, to each their own and play on!

    I wonder why they didn't re-inflate them. When I read they took one off for testing I assumed they'd fix it if it needed fixing. Probably just protocol.

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    for those still using the temperature excuse, here is a table that shows the conversion to the PSI

    http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/ai...ume-d_853.html

    At 50F(gametime temp), the correction is .96...so if the ball was on the low end (12.5 psi), so the ball could have reduced to 12...and with a few other variables as little as 11.8 psi. The balls all came in at 10.5 psi. Forget the weather. It doesn't fly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    The balls were tested by the officials and were of proper psi, then they were given to the Pats...then they were tested again and they were low psi. Not sure how anyone else did it...and when none of the opposting teams balls failed...hmmm.

    As for the scuffing, I agree, don't let them do it. But balls are used in multiple games so they will naturally get scuffed. Unless they mandate new balls for every game, not sure how that would work.
    But it isn't direct proof. In a sense, you got a dead body, but no murder weapon, or witness. Hard to say they did it and not actually have any testimony or evidence (video) that a member of or player of the Patriots organization actually did the deflating. Wouldn't you be pissed if they accused our organization of something and took away high draft picks or made us forfeit games with something that is implied rather than proved?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neo View Post
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    But it isn't direct proof. In a sense, you got a dead body, but no murder weapon, or witness. Hard to say they did it and not actually have any testimony or evidence (video) that a member of or player of the Patriots organization actually did the deflating. Wouldn't you be pissed if they accused our organization of something and took away high draft picks or made us forfeit games with something that is implied rather than proved?
    True. I agree. However, the balls were 'entrusted' to the Patriots...so anything that happens to them after that is their responsibility. It is their job to make sure they stay in the state that they were received and remove them from the game if they are not.

    Guilty by inaction at the very least. Oh, and people are found guilty based on circumstantial evidence all the time.
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    And now...the smoking gun

    NBC News reports that Brady addressed his teammates behind closed doors today, telling his fellow Patriots that he prefers the football “a certain way.” Brady also urged everyone to stay focused on the Super Bowl.

    If the “certain way” Brady likes his footballs is to be inflated to less than 12.5 psi, and if Brady either deflated footballs to less than 12.5 psi or asked someone else to deflate footballs to less than 12.5 psi, then he was breaking NFL rules.
    There is NO DOUBT now. Brady was involved and KNEW what he was doing. The NFL may sit on this until after the SuperBowl...but Brady and Belichick and the Patriots are going to pay for this one.

    Troy Aikman says he thinks the punishment should be MORE than what the Saints got because the Saints didn't get a competitive advantage, while this is at a minimum the SECOND time the Patriots have been caught doing something that did.
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    It should be obvious to anyone who looks at it honestly.

    John Harbaugh insisted the Patriots used deflated balls in the previous week's win over the Ravens. No one listened. So he bribed the ball boys to deflate the Patriots' balls, told the Colts the balls might be low, and lo and behold, they were.

    He then jumped in his time machine, went back to 1963, and as one of the three tramps on the grassy knoll, shot JFK because he just hates Massachusetts THAT much.
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    I will only say this one last thing and then I'm done with this.

    Has anyone asked themselves why BB or Tom Brady would risk EVERYTHING, every record set, every Super Bowl won, a chance to be enshrined in the Hall of Fame, and risk tainting this years Super Bowl, on a seemingly on a very minor advantage? And they practically crucified themselves on national TV by saying that they had no knowledge of the footballs being tampered with. They are royally fucked now. If anyone finds proof that they had anything to do with this, giving the history, they destroyed everything they worked for their entire careers. BB would have been better off just coming out and saying that it was true and that the players didn't know about it. Now the whole team is fucked.

    I honestly believe that they wouldn't be that stupid . I really believe Tom when he said he didn't know anything about it.
    Last edited by Neo; 01-23-2015 at 12:19 AM.

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    Also, I think this is so stupid that this should actually be a rule change. If they let them scuff the ball (for a better grip) , then they should allow them to slightly adjust the air pressure (for a better grip) as long as it's not to drastic and close to what the league is specified as normal. It doesn't hurt the opposing offense AT ALL. They use their own footballs!

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    The NFL said the evidence "thus far supports the conclusion that footballs that were under-inflated were used by the Patriots in the first half." The league confirmed that prior to the game, the balls were all tested and found to be of satisfactory inflation, and that the balls were all properly inflated for the second half and remained that way.

    http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/01/23/def...s-nfl-response
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    Quote Originally Posted by madmadworld View Post
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    The NFL said the evidence "thus far supports the conclusion that footballs that were under-inflated were used by the Patriots in the first half." The league confirmed that prior to the game, the balls were all tested and found to be of satisfactory inflation, and that the balls were all properly inflated for the second half and remained that way.

    http://www.si.com/nfl/2015/01/23/def...s-nfl-response
    Just heard that part...and what that means is the "it leaked" excuse is gone.
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    how about if ...... a bad gauge ? made in China crap lol
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