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Thread: Why Pettine Won't Start Manziel

  1. #49
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    I'd say the lack of a running game and underachieving receivers has been more limiting than McCown.

    But you can change out the QB more easily than any of those other problems. It's a long shot frankly, but maybe Manziel's legs and propensity to look for the long ball when flushed out will help. I wouldn't bet on it, but worst case scenario is we still lose while figuring out the QB situation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by OconRecon View Post
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    I'd say the lack of a running game and underachieving receivers has been more limiting than McCown.

    But you can change out the QB more easily than any of those other problems. It's a long shot frankly, but maybe Manziel's legs and propensity to look for the long ball when flushed out will help. I wouldn't bet on it, but worst case scenario is we still lose while figuring out the QB situation.
    No question about that. McCown would be even more effective if he wasn't taking such a pounding due to poor blocking and had a run game. This almost reminds me of the Tim Couch era the way poor Tim was crucified every Sunday. I can't believe this OL is this bad!

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    Quote Originally Posted by OconRecon View Post
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    But you can change out the QB more easily than any of those other problems.
    Can you really? I mean the same rational exists for playing backups at receiver, RB, and OL.

    Quote Originally Posted by OconRecon View Post
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    It's a long shot frankly, but maybe Manziel's legs and propensity to look for the long ball when flushed out will help. I wouldn't bet on it, but worst case scenario is we still lose while figuring out the QB situation.
    I totally get it Ocon and I've officially reached that point after the AZ loss. While not mathematically eliminated, the team knows they're out. Making the move to Manziel after the beatings that McCown has suffered is pretty easy whether its this week or the next. Does anyone actually think McCown WON'T take a beating against Cincy's pretty brutal DL?

    One thing's for sure: If Manziel is the magic, missing ingredient that will make Pettine and Co's approach to developing him look really dumb. I mean if he can take over for a guy posting a mid 90's passer rating and turn this team into a winner.....

    I'd love it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greythan View Post
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    Can you really? I mean the same rational exists for playing backups at receiver, RB, and OL.


    I totally get it Ocon and I've officially reached that point after the AZ loss. While not mathematically eliminated, the team knows they're out. Making the move to Manziel after the beatings that McCown has suffered is pretty easy whether its this week or the next. Does anyone actually think McCown WON'T take a beating against Cincy's pretty brutal DL?

    One thing's for sure: If Manziel is the magic, missing ingredient that will make Pettine and Co's approach to developing him look really dumb. I mean if he can take over for a guy posting a mid 90's passer rating and turn this team into a winner.....

    I'd love it.
    I think Mccown will get beat up by ANY defensive line. The dude holds the ball like its a long lost relative.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LHCDawgPound View Post
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    Yeah the more I read about this policy of letting the players pull themselves out of the games the more I am questioning Pettine.
    Pettine really screwed up not taking Josh out. That's why his HC, to make decisions regardless of what the player wants.

  6. #54
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    1. There is still a little matter of the NFL investigation to consider
    2. Manziel looked decent in his time under center...but still completing only 56% of his passes (not bad, but not great)
    3. The next game is in 4 days
    4. The bye is the week after the Steelers....with games against 2-6 SF and 2-6 Baltimore in the next 3 games

    we can all make lists of reasons TO start Manziel, and lists of reasons NOT to start Manziel. We are ALL going on limited information when compared to what the coaches have available.

    I am not a conspiracy theorist. I believe Pettine wants to win...and that for whatever reason (continuity, ball safety, whatever) he thinks McCown gives that to him RIGHT NOW.

    I tend to believe Haslam wants the Browns to build continuity and that he has told both Farmer and Pettine they are safe going into 2016 so they can continue on the process...so no hurry to put Manziel in to 'prove' anything. It is about putting the Browns...and by extrapolation Manziel...in the best position to win LONG TERM as well as now.

    For all we know, they think Manziel IS better...but they don't think the TEAM is good enough around him to risk putting him in.

    OR

    Manziel may suck but they are holding him out hoping for a better pick before the draft when they trade him.

    IDK. All I know is that for the first time in forever we have a guy as HC that I actually think looks/sounds/acts like a HC...and players seem to WANT to play for him. Sure, things are far from perfect, but this team seems like a team that a couple of pieces could change the outlook dramatically.

    Get a balls out pass rusher
    Get a top end WR threat (Gordon???)

    If Manziel IS the guy...then those two things alone will move the dial considerably.
    Football is all about synergy. Replace a poor player with a great player and watch the surrounding players suddenly seem vastly improved. When you aren't covering for someone else, you can do YOUR JOB better.



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    Quote Originally Posted by DawgFan View Post
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    I tend to believe Haslam wants the Browns to build continuity and that he has told both Farmer and Pettine they are safe going into 2016 so they can continue on the process...so no hurry to put Manziel in to 'prove' anything. It is about putting the Browns...and by extrapolation Manziel...in the best position to win LONG TERM as well as now.
    There is no fucking way I'll allow myself to get excited, but this has been rattling around my brain-box as well. Even today, Pettine was asked about fans saying he's "refusing" to play Manziel, and he rejected it while talking about how much he likes his development.

    Focusing on a young player's development, in this circumstance, it makes me wonder if he knows he's safe. It doesn't make sense that he'd be on the verge of being fired and he'd still not throw Manziel in, even if it was just to shut everyone up. Desperate measures, and what not.

    I'm hopeful everyone is telling Jimmy the cold, harsh reality of the moment - The team isn't good enough to win, it's going to hurt Johnny to throw him in this shit and abandon his development, and constant coaching overturn hasn't worked the past two decades and won't work next year.

    That, that would be fucking cool.

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    I'm about to be so vindicated I'm going to have to change my name to Dr.BoatShoes

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    I'm not sure how Ray Farmer could sit in a meeting with Haslam and Pettine while concurring on the notion that the team doesn't have enough talent. That would take some massive balls considering the natural evolution of that conversation to our last four first round picks and the small matter of Dwayne Bowe.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BoatShoes View Post
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    I'm about to be so vindicated I'm going to have to change my name to Dr.BoatShoes
    Vindicated from what? Throwing a mess of conspiracy theories with endless tendrils allowing you to claim "See! I was right" in any scenario where Pettine, Farmer, and/or the team at large fails?

    I'll go ahead and give you an "Atta boy!" now just to get it out of the way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BoatShoes View Post
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    I'm about to be so vindicated I'm going to have to change my name to Dr.BoatShoes

    Spit it out BS...do you know something?? or is just another riddle?
    just beat it

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    just my post history re: pettine and manziel.

  13. #61
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    The problem with the whole "talent" argument is you cant prove it unless you see that talent in game.

    You can just as easily say Pettine is an idiot for keeping talent on the bench

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    Quote Originally Posted by LHCDawgPound View Post
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    I think Mccown will get beat up by ANY defensive line. The dude holds the ball like its a long lost relative.
    That is part of it and he also doesn't see pressure coming very well. These are poor traits for a highly experienced QB in the league a
    long time.

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    We need to centralize discussion, I have two manziel threads ongoing so I will close this one and ask that discussion be resumed in the (30th!) megathread.
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