DawgsDefense
Active member
Browns should sign kaepernick if hes released. I bet jets sign him.....
MEGATHREADmania XXX
- Thread starter Enigmatic Evil
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DawgFan
In NFL HELL since 1964
Ummm...NOBODY should sign Kaepernick.
Kaep can't read defenses, he is a head case, and has regressed every year since his first. He also takes too many sacks, fumbles a lot, and has a low completion percentage.
The book is out on him...career backup.
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Enigmatic Evil
Mr. Censor
AttackOffense
Well-known member
Browns' problems not at QB They need a good running back, some OLs who can run block and push defenses off the line of scrimmage, a big receiver who is good, defensive ends who are tough and good and don't get pushed around, and billions of tough, fast linebackers.
Gambler
Active member
I know some say that crow is not an elite back, I agree with that. But he's good if he's not getting hit in the backfield and when he actually has a hole to run through.
Brownsfan
Continuity Please!
Love your dry humor. But those were nice comments by Thomas. I think Manziel showed flashes last night of what he can become. I am not sure he was much better last night than he was in the Tennessee game. He was, of course, playing a much better team and it is all relative. I think he needs to be playing.
next2nothing
Full Disco
Manziel needs to be playing so there is no doubt on whether he can do it or not.
If he can't do it then the Browns can move on. If he can, which I highly doubt, then the Browns can form a strategy on building around him going into the off-season.
It would be a terrible mistake to keep throwing McCown out there.
2-7. It's over.
If he can't do it then the Browns can move on. If he can, which I highly doubt, then the Browns can form a strategy on building around him going into the off-season.
It would be a terrible mistake to keep throwing McCown out there.
2-7. It's over.
BoatShoes
On a boat, bruh.
I rewatched already.
Wheels come off after the 7th posession.
I cant find fault in his play on the first 3 posessions of the second half. Maybe in the 3rd, but cant see enough.
The first two were great.
Scramble/short of first down
Dropped big gain passes in second
Then We were down 21 with 7 minutes to play so johnny started going for the home run and he was trying to force things.
Its almost like he was trying to win.
Silly, kid.
Wheels come off after the 7th posession.
I cant find fault in his play on the first 3 posessions of the second half. Maybe in the 3rd, but cant see enough.
The first two were great.
Scramble/short of first down
Dropped big gain passes in second
Then We were down 21 with 7 minutes to play so johnny started going for the home run and he was trying to force things.
Its almost like he was trying to win.
Silly, kid.
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Greythan
Yin & Yang
A balanced review. Well done!
On a more serious note, I liked the way he played last night and would agree wholely with the notion of him playing from here on out. I would offer a less than an A+ evaluation such as you provided ("Hey, he made some bad plays but he was trying to win. So, stated another way, they were actually all great plays." Sort of the same way you evaluated his ridiculous interception in his previous start against the Bengals).
What IS clear to me is that there is no way for us, as fans, to leave with any other impression other than the kid needs more PT. Seeing the reads earlier, adjusting the pace/placement of his throws, and all the other constructive critiques would seem to be things that need playing time to learn and ultimately to evaluate.
I will certainly struggle to understand what possible football related reason there would be for going back to McCown. I don't think there is a good, pure football reason. If they do go back to McCown, I'm stuck considering the non-football factors such as trust and other such personality traits.
He played pretty well last night, but saying you can't find fault with his play that yielded zero first downs in three possessions is pretty ridiculous. Again, he'd likely take umbrage with your evaluation himself.
OP
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Enigmatic Evil
Mr. Censor
I don't get why this team can't just come out and let Johnny start the rest of the season. We have NOTHING to gain from giving McCown more starts.
Tangelo930
Die-hard Browns Fan
If McCown starts the rest of the way I might not even watch. It would literally feel completely pointless. What are we hoping to accomplish by doing that? Best thing we can hope for by doing that is losing draft position. The Browns situation feels so hopeless right now. Very little, if anything, to be excited about.
BruceWayne
Active member
Not trying to be a jerk, but in your opinion, what faults did you see in Manziel's first 3 possessions of the second half?
Brownsfan
Continuity Please!
I agree that there is no good football reason for going back to McCown, but I can think of some other possibly valid non-football reasons, none of which are complimentary of Pettine.
Brownsfan
Continuity Please!
I am sure it will not be pointless to Pettine.
Greythan
Yin & Yang
They didn't yield a single first down. Calling Manziel faultless for that would seem to indicate blame belongs on the other 10 guys. Cincy's defense isn't THAT good for cripesakes.
Brownsfan
Continuity Please!
Not sure who you are talking to, but, in case it is to me, my guess is that Manziel was given instructions to stay in the pocket. It is true, of course, that Lewis also wanted to keep Manziel in the pocket, but for different reasons. However, with Lewis and Pettine working together, it worked to perfection to achieve Lewis' purpose.
Now I have a question for you. Since the running game was going pretty good in the first half, why, in your opinion, was it abandoned in the second half?
BruceWayne
Active member
I was looking for specifics. He was 2nd and 19 from the 3. Gained 7 to Benji I believe then scrambled on third for what we thought was a first down, but overruled by CInci's challenge.
The second series he made what I believe was his best throw to Gabriel but hit him in the upper knee. That's a 18 yard pickup wasted. The next throw a slant to Benjamin for 6 and on 3rd and 4 he hit barnidges hand with a tight window. Actually a pretty good throw. Not blaming Barnidge but I've seen him make 3 harder catches in the last couple of games.
The third series started with a called roll out that fooled no one and ended with a collapsing pocket and two consecutive sacks. By the next possession it's 31-10 in the 4th.
AttackOffense
Well-known member
Some posters here, Bruce Wayne, don't get it that the receivers can't get open, the line can't block for the run well and that really inhibits the ability of a QB against a good, active defense. Manziel would have been a lot better with some talent to work with.
BruceWayne
Active member
I agree AO he needs some talent on offense, but he is also not at the level of McCown in his trust and recognition of where to go with the ball. In my opinion, he showed the ability to make the throws needed to be successful. Combine that with his ability to improv when the pocket collapses and he could be what I think he can.
McCown is more "naturally" accurate, having 13 years in the league and all of the first team reps (almost) since the spring. I estimate that 25% of the accuracy difference between Manziel and McCown is based on the reps and familiarity with the receivers.
I don't see the value in continuing with McCown at this point. This team is probably two years away at minimum from a playoff run. That would make McCown 38 years old. That's if a plethora of other ills are cleaned up.
To gain what?
Manziel knows the playbook and is familiar with quite a few defensive reads. There are timing issues to be sure and a few other things that need to be developed with on the field experience. If now is not a good time, there won't be one.
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