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Analytics

DePodesta is a really, really smart dude who's put in the time, stood on the shoulders of giants and all that, to understand the best use of sports analytics. He's at the forefront.

Is that good? Evidence suggests yes. All the best organizations are bringing the two "sides" together and using the best data just as much as they can. They don't talk about a lot, which is understandable. But the truth is, we're in keep up or get out of the way territory.

"Don't Be a Gettlemen."
 
Everyone should read this:

https://www.adn.com/sports/national...nt-has-finally-reached-the-sports-mainstream/

Joe Banner wasn’t expecting the phone call, but it didn’t surprise him. The former NFL executive sensed the current NFL head coach on the other end of the line, an old-school guy, needed a confidant outside his organization. The coach had spent his life around the game, knew it as well as anyone, but now it was being transformed by numbers he didn’t understand. So, the coach asked, what should he know about analytics?

Banner, an advocate and early adopter of advanced football statistics, understood why coaches feared them. It felt like a threat to their decision-making power. But he explained to the coach that they were basically advanced versions of the "tendency reports" he had been receiving from assistant coaches, who would scout opponents to determine how they approached every game situation, for years.

"Analytics are sophisticated, accurate and quality information," Banner said. "There should be no coach afraid of that."
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That is just the first couple paragraphs...what follows is something that should make the Browns fans VERY happy with the direction of the team and our FO.
 
Awesome. I feel pretty clear that analytics are the future of the NFL (and the present of MLB), and it's high time. Got a slower start and went down a little harder, not surprising given the psychographics surrounding the game, the old-school-ness and hyper masculinity not as associated with the NBA or MLB. But we've clearly entered that brave new world.

It's on now and the best organizations seem the most eager to become "Smart Teams." The Browns are the most overt about it right now, racing to the forefront, but everybody's gonna wake up to it sooner or later.

Or get replaced.
 
Pretty sure that’s the “alignment” Jimmy keeps talking about. Didn’t see Freddie’s good ol’ boy-isms and Dorsey laughing at thousands of pages of research as a path to the future.

I really think Stef will get a 3 year run at minimum.

And I’m not knocking Dorsey, I loved a lot about him, he was a blast. He left the cupboard 80% full. But his rep to know respectfully play well with other apparently caught up to him.

Speaking of analytics, from the financial side, are we going to let Vernon go? Sure is an easy way to save 15 mil in cap space, without a hit, and can likely sign a similar talent for 8-10.
 
My gut says we can move on from Vernon, replace him at a more reasonable dollar figure. If we could flip him for Trent Williams, that would be ideal.

I'm guessing his production and salary don't get a high rating from the analytics process. But I'm certain the same would be true at WR.
 
Shep said:
My gut says we can move on from Vernon, replace him at a more reasonable dollar figure. If we could flip him for Trent Williams, that would be ideal.

I'm guessing his production and salary don't get a high rating from the analytics process. But I'm certain the same would be true at WR.
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I agree with trying to trade Vernon for Williams. I never understood the trade for Vernon in the first place. I thought Zeitler had more value to the team. And trading Ogbah for Murphy in order to make room for an aging Vernon made no sense to me.

But if analytics says we don't need OBJ and Jarvis, I would tend to chuck that part of analytics.
 
Shep said:
My gut says we can move on from Vernon, replace him at a more reasonable dollar figure. If we could flip him for Trent Williams, that would be ideal.

I'm guessing his production and salary don't get a high rating from the analytics process. But I'm certain the same would be true at WR.
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I don't know why your in love with an aging vet like Williams who can't make it a full season anymore... Sorry.. But this makes 0 common sense.... Id rather invest in younger talent... we shouldn't be the ones to send him into the sunset with big money... let someone else do it...
 
Gotta disagree. Trent Williams has been one of the best three or four LTs in the NFL over the past decade... but he's 100% healthy, rested, and only 31. It's a younger version of what the Rams did and it allowed them to get that program up and running fast.

I love the idea of a young OT spending a few years at RT before moving over. Wirfs (in our scheme his entire career) would look so good opposite Trent Williams.

I really do not see starting two rookies, but it's just one of the ways to go. Could go Bulaga on the right side, rookie on the left. Not a ton of veteran options, bet we add a lesser known dude too.
 
Shep... how does Trent do in the wide spread? Should we just trade assets and plug players in independent of scheme? I would hope the GM would like at these things before throwing spaghetti at the wall. Maybe we should play chess instead of checkers thumbup


I would consider looking at signing someone (or plural) with experience in the wide zone scheme who can solidify and hope teach and focus on acquiring elite talent in the draft to groom to take over.
 
Up to 2015 it was Shanny's ZBS, but Callahan came over and turned it into a 'situational' scheme, meaning they mix...which is probably why they suck. Too many techniques to remember. Browns tried that and the OL looked a mess.
 
OconRecon said:
Pretty sure that’s the “alignment” Jimmy keeps talking about. Didn’t see Freddie’s good ol’ boy-isms and Dorsey laughing at thousands of pages of research as a path to the future.

I really think Stef will get a 3 year run at minimum.

And I’m not knocking Dorsey, I loved a lot about him, he was a blast. He left the cupboard 80% full. But his rep to know respectfully play well with other apparently caught up to him.

Speaking of analytics, from the financial side, are we going to let Vernon go? Sure is an easy way to save 15 mil in cap space, without a hit, and can likely sign a similar talent for 8-10.
Click to expand...

Except that never happened and there is zero evidence that it ever happened. There is a single Tweet from a random Canadian who usually tweets his undying loyalty to DePudpuller making up a story that Dorsey did that.

Irregardless if he did or didn't, a John Dorsey roster is in the Super Bowl. Dorsey also took this 1 win in 2 years joke of a roster DePodesta and Brown crafted and had us go from 1 win every other year to 7 wins every year as we got better and better.

Yeah you DePo fanboys are right. Fuck that noise. Who gives a shit about Championships and being great. Let's go back to drafting low talent garbage based on SPARQ scores.

Sounds great and continues our 21 year and counting tradition of being the NFL's door mat. Sounds fucking lovely.
 
I get the Sashi context for the SPARQ/athletic testing slander. But if we're being honest here, how do we think Paton & the Vikes landed on Danielle Hunter (4.5 sacks in his time at LSU) as a third round mega-bargain? Just pure dumb luck, or...

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Those Minny dudes also went with a testing freak OL in the second frame in '18 — unlike Corbett, O'Neill has been able to stay on the outside & play at a reasonably high level (70.8 PFF grade).
 
I'm all for having a cohesive vision in house. The Browns, having been often and for a long time a goddamn circus inside Berea and on the field as a result, something has got to give. If it's time for affable co-operation without "ego" and bla-bla-bla okay cool. The number crunchers will keep doing as they have. If we have, for whatever reason, managment or coaches who don't want to use the information then what is the point in having that managment or coach. Just saying, from an organizational point of view it makes sense. Haslam, clearly a slow learner, has finally realized this. Will it work out? I fucking hope so.
 
The real key is progressive thinkers on the coaching staff who legit WANT this information, are excited for those sessions, truly and deeply believe information is power, not a threat to their dick lengths.

We have that. I'm already getting a more relaxed feeling, not stressing whether Freddie is way smarter than he seems and hopefully having two OCs from different coaching trees only FEELS like a horrible idea because I'm too basic to wrap my brain around it.

Next I wanna hear that yes, having the guys who will be playing together actually practice together, to get that intricate timing down? We do believe that's a solid plan.
 
I rewatched some of Money Ball last night. Based on the 2002/2003ish Oakland A's where DePodesta was the GM. This is I think where the analytic/sabermetrics methods were really sort of born in pro sports.

That team won 20 games in a row without having any recognizable talent. But they did have some real good young starting pitching that year. And that I don't think you can plug in statistical data to know if some kids will succeed or not.

Depodesta wasn't too thrilled about the way he was portrayed as an awkward number cruncher.

To be fair I was surprised to read he did play football in college. So yeah more or less 20 years later even with the advances in technology/analyzing sports I still see analytics as things to take serious. But not the end or all or be all
 
I've had jobs in the past in bookkeeping, accounts payable/receivable, and collections. Pleasant enough work but not particularly glamorous. When I dealt with the more established/seasoned accountants/financial analysts/analytical thinkers one of my main critiques of them was I thought they didn't understand people all that well. For example this one woman I used to know was very much an accountant. Meaning she sort of had all the bad stereotypes of that profession. I knew her husband as well. I knew him well enough to know he never checked his answering machine. But in this woman's infinite knowledge so to speak she'd still leave him messages and wait for him to call back. You can't fix stupid there in that way lol.

In that article about DePodesta he kind of dances around addressing how exactly he uses his analytical methods imo. I mean if I go onto YouTube some algorithm I imagine will give me a bunch of recommended videos based on my search history. Same thing with shopping on Amazon. I'll get recommend items to buy based on my shopping/spending history. Not necessarily number crunching to come with those algorithms as much as it is just having some formula spit something out. For the record it gets some of my interests/likes correct but not always.

I mean I hope it works out this year but I'm just not a fan of reliance on analytics for all decision making. To the point you're using that type of analysis to understand skills/likes/ etc..
 
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